Central Virginia
Albemarle County
Board of Supervisors None 4/13/2016
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Board of Supervisors None
4/13/2016
Attachments
Agenda.pdf
Minutes.pdf
1. Call to Order.
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0:00
2. Discussion and Adoption of Calendar Year 2016 Tax Rate Resolution.
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0:46
Passed 5-1-0
adopted
3. Discussion and Adoption of FY 2016/17 Capital and Operating Budgets.
▶︎
1:54:16
Passed 4-2-0
adopted
Work Session:
4. Capital Improvement Program (CIP) General Obligation Bond Referendum Work Session.
16-274 Att.A FY17 Prioritized Project Expenditure Summary Proposed.pdf
16-274 Att.B FY17 Prioritized Project Expenditure Summary By Functional Area Proposed.pdf
16-274 Att.C Other Jurisdictions Ref Questions.pdf
5. From the Board: Committee Reports and Matters Not Listed on the Agenda.
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2:09:31
6. From the County Executive: Report on Matters Not Listed on the Agenda.
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2:11:59
7. Closed Meeting.
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2:12:11
8. Certify Closed Meeting.
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2:13:02
9. Adjourn to April 19, 2016, 6:00 p.m., Room 241.
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2:20:47
Adoption of Budget Resolution.
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2:20:46
1. Call to Order.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:00:00
We need to call to order the Albemarle County Board of Supervisors April 13th work session.
00:00:09
And thank you for all who are joining us today.
00:00:13
I have a couple introductions for folks in the audience and anybody watching us online.
00:00:23
Our officer for today is Officer Riley.
00:00:26
Thank you very much for joining us, sir.
00:00:28
Up on the dais with us is our county attorney, Larry Davis, and to my far left is our county executive, Tom Foley, and our director of the Office of Management and Budget, Lori Allshouse.
2. Discussion and Adoption of Calendar Year 2016 Tax Rate Resolution.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:00:46
I don't know why I have such a hard time with director of, I don't know, but I do.
00:00:53
And I'll just, I guess we should just get started and let Lori take us on.
SPEAKER_07
00:00:58
All right.
00:00:59
Thank you, Madam Chairman, members of the board.
00:01:01
Today I've brought information to you for the adoption of the calendar year 2016 tax rate and the adoption of the 17 capital and operating budgets.
00:01:13
I just wanted to start with where we are today.
00:01:18
The budget was Mr. Foley or the county executive's recommended budget that the board made amendments to along the way throughout all these work sessions.
00:01:27
So this slide is just a summary of the amendments that have been made by the board to the budget, the recommended budget.
00:01:34
You added a CAT bus route to Fifth Street Station.
00:01:38
You restored funding to the Legal Aid Justice Center.
00:01:41
You added CIP funding for Woodbrook School Edition Design.
00:01:45
You redirected local government's cost reduction in health insurance expenses to the CIP for ACE.
00:01:52
You added one school resource officer.
00:01:54
And you moved the technology productivity initiative funding to the category of innovation fund.
00:02:02
So those are the changes along the way.
00:02:06
This slide just shows the dollar amounts associated with those changes.
00:02:10
I won't go through all the details, but that's the work we did in the Office of Management and Budget as we worked on your budget resolution.
00:02:17
So those are the changes that occurred.
00:02:19
As you know, the school resource officer position is including school funding of 78,247 based on the school division sharing the funding for that position.
00:02:35
There's those pie charts, your total county budget.
00:02:41
I'm moving right to the resolution to set the tax rate, and we also have a resolution in front of you to adopt the budget.
00:02:50
Are there any questions or discussion?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:02:56
Board, does anybody have any other thing they'd like to talk about before we ask for a motion?
SPEAKER_06
00:03:03
the resolution in front of you is the advertised tax rate.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:03:10
I guess if we're about to have a motion I will make one comment now and that is I think that the budget process has been really really well done and I appreciate all the work that staff has done and I'm sorry I can't vote for it because I really just can't vote for the raise that was adopted but I won't take it personally and we'll just move on.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:03:29
And can I just add something to that?
00:03:32
Maybe to piggyback on something Ann just said.
00:03:39
The raise that you were considering, Ann, was dropping the 2% to 1%.
00:03:46
I think that's right.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:03:47
That was the motion that didn't get a second.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:03:50
Right, so that's what you're talking about.
00:03:51
That was the equivalent of $400,000 for us.
00:03:56
The ACE program that we added in yesterday at your motion was 288,000, which would take us a good ways towards covering that 400,000, the difference of that 400,000.
00:04:11
and we've also added in the Fifth Street Station for CAP which is 123,000.
00:04:19
So if you add the 288 and the 411, that brings us to a little over 400,000 which would make up the difference between those two for your ability to maybe support it.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:32
I'm not demanding any changes to be made.
00:04:35
I just wanted to explain my point of view.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:37
But I'm just saying that that's another way that you could look at it to get at the raises for our employees.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:44
The vote has been had on the percentage raise.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:47
I'm not trying to argue with that.
SPEAKER_02
00:04:48
I think I have a right to explain why the vote matters.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:50
I'm just explaining to you that it was only a matter of $400,000.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:04:53
There's a way we can get to it.
00:04:57
It's $3,300,000 for the whole county, and that is a lot of zeros.
00:05:02
That's the point I was taking, not just the local government side.
00:05:05
You were talking about the raise.
00:05:07
That's the cost of the raise.
00:05:09
So that's why I was trying to draw attention to that, both last October and November when we did the compensation to begin with.
00:05:18
this has been in nine years.
00:05:20
What usually happens is that we have a very difficult time coming back if we set something much higher or set a 2%, we can never seem to get back to 1% if that really is what's necessary.
00:05:33
But as I said, that's my point of view alone and it doesn't, I'm not trying to have it carry over to anybody else, I just wanted to explain.
00:05:42
Thank you.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:05:42
Well I just thought maybe we could come up with a compromise that would help you get there.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:05:45
I think the...
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:05:47
So that everything would be funded.
00:05:49
Okay.
SPEAKER_05
00:05:51
Would anybody else like to... Yeah, Madam Chairman, I'd just like to add my one and a half pennies worth, if I may.
00:05:57
I will not be able to vote for this budget.
00:06:00
I commend staff and County Executive Holley for presenting what I think was a very bare bones, realistic budget.
00:06:09
And it troubles me greatly that last night we approved the addition of a new
00:06:15
higher for the county when the statement to the public when we went out in meetings with the public is we were not adding any additional personnel and we approved that person last night without really the full figure being known
00:06:31
My eyes jump at $156,495 being added literally the night before we vote on the final budget.
00:06:42
There's been very little opportunity for the public to weigh in on that and discuss it.
00:06:47
So out of principle, I will not be able to support that.
00:06:51
Secondly,
00:06:52
My effort was to try not to penalize county employees and victimize them by reducing the proposed salary increase in here.
00:07:02
I saw, however, given the budget of austerity that was presented to us, that we needed to embrace a concept of shared sacrifice among all parties in the county.
00:07:15
to move the county forward and position it fiscally to deal with the kinds of stressors that we're dealing with, especially the increased dependency on property taxes and thereby the concomitant refusal of the General Assembly to enable us to broaden our repertoire of financial revenue sources.
00:07:37
I did feel that if we could get down to a 1% in the second half of the year salary increase, we would have resulted in a savings that was approximately 1.5 pennies of the budget that is being proposed today and that we could have potentially been talking about a tax increase of somewhere around a penny to maybe a penny and a quarter.
00:08:05
I will note that that could not be viewed as a proposed budget that would in any way jeopardize the school system.
00:08:13
The schools which would have continued to get 0.4 cents would have also, as we have made a decision here this week, have received 887,000 one-time dollars.
00:08:26
which comes to nearly a penny 1.547 million dollars almost a penny that would have been dedicated to the school division so it would have been a no sacrifice to the school division
00:08:41
and I'm troubled by the fact that the county executive I think has fulfilled his charge to us as a board to present us with a fiscally realistic budget and we have blown by that and we are proposing two and a half cent increase for taxpayers and therefore I cannot support it.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:09:03
Okay, does anybody else have any comments to make?
00:09:09
I'm just going to make one really quick one.
00:09:13
I would like to, I am going to support the tax increase that we needed for all the reasons that I've said before.
00:09:22
But I would like to propose that we do things a lot different with respect to our outreach to the state this year.
00:09:29
I'd like to at some point talk about backing up our meeting with the legislatures from back to a couple more months before.
00:09:37
We have done it in the past two years since I've been on the board and really work this summer to look at the possibility of a bill.
00:09:47
and I'm sure other people are doing this in other communities to offset the proffer bill that went through last year so quickly, excuse me, this year so quickly and also to consider how we can better approach our state legislators about increased tax authority.
00:10:09
We're doing it too late in the year.
00:10:12
and we really need to get our act together over the summer I think and address them earlier.
00:10:17
So at some point I'd like to have a discussion about that.
SPEAKER_05
00:10:20
I think that's a great idea, Madam Chairman.
00:10:22
I would just like to suggest that we find other like-minded counties that are in a very similar straits that we are and that there's a power of coalition and we need to be a collective group of counties that make appeals not just to our local legislators but to the legislature as a body as well because there's power in numbers
00:10:46
Otherwise, I don't think we're going to move those digits for us in terms of the legislature being forthcoming.
00:10:53
I think we're just going to go through the same motions and we're going to come to the same place again in terms of outcome.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:10:58
So that's why I say I think we really need to change up the way we've been doing and have, I know Ann has been very much involved in this at VACO and going down to Richmond.
00:11:10
I plan to get a lot more involved over the summer myself and I'm hoping that we'll be able to do something by the end of the summer that can be put forward.
00:11:19
You know, Liz, to your comment, it might be interesting this summer if we start off with
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:11:41
Just a discussion with some different people than we've talked to before.
00:11:46
Maybe Emmett Hanger, someone that is a little different person, just for some advice on reaching out to some folks like that.
00:11:58
Yeah, legislators would be a really good idea.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:01
Legislators, yes, that actually sit on the local government committee.
00:12:05
I think we need to understand the local government committee a little bit better, at least I think I do.
00:12:11
Some people might just think we're not going to get anywhere, but hope springs eternal.
00:12:17
So, anyway.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:19
Even though he doesn't represent us anymore would be helpful.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:22
I'm just, what I'm saying, his advice might be very good for us.
00:12:27
So I would start with maybe something with Emmett.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:29
The other is the High Growth Coalition.
00:12:32
I've been forwarded, suggested that you guys sign up with David Bailey's emails earlier in the legislative session, and I think that helps you to stay involved with what's going on.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:41
Okay, thank you.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:42
The thing is, with the proper bill, the home builders were working all summer and all fall, and we didn't find out about the legislation.
00:12:50
I mean, you can't fight something you don't have the wording for, which is part of the reason why we're always behind, no matter how well prepared our legal department is, and it's always changing.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:12:58
They had a very well organized concerted effort to get that through.
00:13:03
So anyway, before we ask for a motion for this tax rate, does anybody have anything else to say and could somebody, would somebody like to move something?
SPEAKER_11
00:13:20
I'll move that we pass the budget as proposed and amended.
SPEAKER_06
00:13:25
The first order of business would be to make a motion to adopt a resolution to set the calendar year 2016 tax rates as presented.
SPEAKER_11
00:13:34
So moved.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:13:36
Second.
00:13:39
Ms. Palmer?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:13:39
Yes.
00:13:40
Mr. Randolph?
SPEAKER_11
00:13:41
Nay.
00:13:42
Mr. Sheffield?
00:13:43
No.
00:13:44
Mr. Deel?
00:13:45
Yes.
SPEAKER_07
00:13:46
Ms. Mallek?
00:13:47
No.
00:13:48
Mr. McKeel?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:13:51
Yes.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:13:57
Okay.
00:13:57
Well, we have a 3-3, so nothing's going forward.
00:14:01
Do we have anybody who would like to make a different motion?
SPEAKER_06
00:14:08
My assumption is that the tax rate that's at issue is just the real estate tax rate, which is one component of the resolutions in front of you.
00:14:18
I would suggest that you reach consensus on a real estate tax rate and then have a formal motion to adopt the resolution once that rate has been substituted.
00:14:29
So if you want to have a discussion as to what the real estate tax rate should be and reach consensus on that, that would be my recommendation.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:14:40
Thank you, Larry.
00:14:41
Would somebody like to?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:14:42
Well, I go back to my earlier suggestion that we look at cutting a few things so that we can maintain where we are, if anybody's interested in that.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:14:55
So we've already voted on some of the things that we want in the budget.
00:15:03
We certainly, Larry, can vote to take those things out.
00:15:07
For instance, if we wanted to, we don't have to adopt the budget now.
00:15:12
We just have to adopt the tax rate.
00:15:14
But since we've already had the discussion yesterday on some of the things that we want to add, is there any problem with taking those out in another vote?
SPEAKER_06
00:15:25
No, the tax rate is assumed in the budget discussions that you had yesterday and the resolution that's in front of you for the proposed adoption of the budget includes that proposed tax rate revenue plus the decisions that you made yesterday and in prior work sessions for things that you wanted in or out of the budget.
00:15:50
So if you lower the tax rate today, then there is going to be required changes to the budget in order to reflect the reduced amount of revenue and to still meet the requirement that you have a balanced budget.
00:16:05
So the bottom line, I guess, is you do need to adapt a tax rate today because you have no other meetings scheduled before April the 15th.
00:16:16
That's the deadline for adopting the real estate tax rate.
00:16:20
You do not have to adopt the budget today if you want to take more time to reflect on what cuts you want to make.
00:16:28
You are legally required to adopt the school portion of the budget by May 15th and the county portion of the budget no later than July 1st.
00:16:38
The consequence of not adopting a budget sooner than that is that you can't appropriate money for fiscal year 17 until you have an adopted budget.
00:16:48
I think that the schedule for appropriating money as proposed by staff was to have that before you on May 4th in order to accommodate certain construction projects over the summer that would require there to be an adopted budget and an appropriation before contracts could be entered into.
00:17:08
So the schedule is kind of important at this point to move forward as quickly as possible that so I would
00:17:17
recommend again that you adopt a tax rate today and then post haste deal with the budget restructuring that would be required to balance it.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:17:27
Okay so that could be done though the very first meeting in May with respect to the budget it's just it's problematic but it would delay the appropriation resolution until you have an adopted budget.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:17:40
I guess surprised because when we had the vote on the percentage of the raise, I thought that was pretty well, had sealed what the rate was going to be because that's where all the biggest investment is.
00:17:54
For those of you who had the vote on the raise, I hope that some of you will make a suggestion if you don't like what's going on here.
SPEAKER_03
00:18:01
I mean, we can take- We can reduce the 0.7 cents that we have for stormwater because we're no longer
00:18:07
under such a strict mandate.
00:18:08
We've got that $288,000 that's for ACE that I don't support.
00:18:14
I've been very vocal in not supporting, and I'm sorry Norman, but the Pantops sidewalks, I just think that's a waste and I think there's a couple of other sidewalks that I just feel like we're wasting money.
00:18:25
There's the 1.7 million that's for transportation revenue sharing that
00:18:30
It'd be great to put it towards transportation projects, but we're just not sustaining the revenues that are needed to fund those kind of projects.
00:18:41
You could go on and on with other things that are temporary, I guess, changes, but it's not gonna address our long-term issue of a funding shortage into the coming years.
00:18:55
A lot of those are one-time things or capital-related items.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:18:58
My understanding of the 1.7 is that it's left over from the Meadow Creek Parkway and has been apportioned to the smaller projects from the last three years.
00:19:08
So somebody better come and fix it.
00:19:09
If that's wrong, then please jump up here, Trevor, and help me.
00:19:12
And the 0.7 cents for stormwater is what is covering our meeting our state obligations right now with current staff.
00:19:22
It is not something that was proposed.
00:19:24
We haven't begun to get to the point of proposing the new operation yet.
00:19:28
that's been in our budget separately set out for the last three years, I think.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:19:32
So for those of you all, though, that aren't comfortable with the proposed tax rate, then it seems like that some of the things that you all have supported that could get us down, I agree with Brad, there are things that we could cut to get there.
00:19:50
And I'm sorry, go ahead, Trevor, the sidewalks.
SPEAKER_00
00:19:53
Madam Chair, members of the board, Trevor Henry, Director of Facilities and Environmental Services.
00:19:57
As it relates to the $1.7 million for transportation revenue sharing, what's in the recommendation is $1.7 in year one and year two.
00:20:06
That is the county share, which would be matched 100% by VDOT.
00:20:11
The funding source for that
00:20:13
is the increase in the card decal tax that the board had discussed during the work session.
00:20:21
So basically there's a modest increase in the decal fee.
00:20:28
That cost or that revenue would cover the debt service for our share of that funding.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:20:33
So the $250,000 which is what we were going to get from the decals is then leveraged by five.
00:20:39
Okay, to get to the, what a good idea, I didn't realize that was what was going to happen.
00:20:45
Okay, thank you.
SPEAKER_00
00:20:45
There are, and Larry might be able to address this in a little more detail, but there are specific uses of that fund of which transportation, revenue sharing, sidewalks are one of them.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:20:54
Okay, well I'm thrilled that that's what it is.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:20:59
Well, so we have on the table we have going back reducing the tax rate if we don't have the four votes and then going into a discussion about what we're going to cut out of that and some of the things that we've got on the table right now.
00:21:16
are the Pantops sidewalks, the storm water, the ACE program, and what was the other, oh and the CAT route, 5th Street Station route.
00:21:30
So those are the things that have been mentioned up to this point.
00:21:33
And of course the raises for the salary.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:21:36
I feel a lot more comfortable knowing what we're going to cut before we set the tax rate.
00:21:45
rather than setting the tax rate and then cutting.
00:21:49
So, I mean.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:21:49
Well, we could.
00:21:50
You have the list.
00:21:51
Yeah, we have the list.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:21:52
You have a list.
00:21:53
Things could be added to the list.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:21:55
Sure.
00:21:57
Does anybody have anything they'd like to add to the list?
SPEAKER_05
00:22:00
Yeah, I've already stated that I feel the school resource officer was a late entrant and I would strongly recommend that we take it out.
00:22:09
That was a five to one vote last night, but I do feel that this is, it breaks the statement and of trust that we've made to the public that we would not be adding any new positions this year.
SPEAKER_11
00:22:26
Well just on that point specifically I don't see that as that that was made as an inviolable pledge it was this is our goals we changed other things in the budget you know we the county executive presents a budget and we negotiate it and talk about it and
00:22:45
inform the public as we go along as we were doing last night we had a public meeting so and I don't think it's a matter of principle you know I can see being against it that's fine but I don't see it as some kind of point of honor or something.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:22:58
Actually it's what we do every year.
SPEAKER_11
00:23:01
Yeah that's how budgets work.
00:23:02
It's part of what we do every year.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:23:03
It was the county executives proposed budget and we we can change the county executives proposed budget.
SPEAKER_05
00:23:10
That's our job.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:23:12
Exactly.
00:23:16
So we have one supervisor who has suggested figuring out what we're going to cut first before we go to the tax rate.
00:23:24
Is that the way everybody else would like to approach this?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:23:27
I guess we could make some motions on things, Larry, to take out.
SPEAKER_06
00:23:32
At this point, one board member who voted against the tax rate needs to change his or her mind.
00:23:42
and if the objection by Mr. Randolph is on that one particular item, then I would suggest that if he might be able to address, if that one item was removed from the budget, whether or not he would vote for the tax rate might resolve the stalemate.
00:24:01
If that's not the issue, the sole issue, then I think you need to start identifying
00:24:08
matters items that you might want to take out of the budget in order to lower the tax rate.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:24:14
I got the impression that there were other things, but Rick, would you?
SPEAKER_05
00:24:17
Yeah, I did state on public record 12 minutes and 43 seconds ago that I also would like to see the salary increase for all county employees lowered and when we had a discussion about this, my colleague did the right
00:24:34
Supervisor Malek said that she would be supportive of a 1% increase for the purposes of compromise and moving the budget forward.
00:24:44
I would be happy to drop my 0% for the first half of the year, 1% for the second half, and subscribe to the proposal of 1% salary increase for county employees for the fiscal year 17.
00:24:59
So if we drop the SRO,
00:25:02
and we move to 1% salary increase and therefore we make adjustment in the tax rate accordingly and potentially drop some other less than significant budget items then you will have my support for the budget.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:25:21
All right, that's a good way to do it.
00:25:23
Let's just go with each person.
00:25:25
I can tell you that I won't support that.
00:25:27
No, I'm not suggesting that.
00:25:28
I'm suspecting everybody say what they want to do.
SPEAKER_03
00:25:29
I'm just adding to that part of the conversation, and that is when Supervisor Randolph suggested that, my initial reaction was there's no way I'm going to
00:25:40
to reduce the potential or impact employees' compensation and still fund millions of dollars of sidewalks.
00:25:48
I'll revise that to say that giving it some thought, the math in my head is that we have about $2 million in debt service that we were facing to have to fund and to balance that, we're going to reduce
00:26:04
compensation or future compensation for employees in order to pay for that debt.
00:26:22
unfortunately balanced this on the back of the employees and I just can't support that in any way, shape or form.
00:26:29
I see them working way too hard and this is in no shape or form trying to garner their goodwill or anything like that but I was emailing back and forth with Trevor last night and to have employees who are willing to actually step up at eight o'clock at night, nine o'clock at night and address problems, I've got employees that
00:26:50
They yet seem to disappoint me on what they do and that's just not something I'm going to support.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:26:59
And nor will I.
00:27:00
The difference between the 1% and the 2% for county government employees is about $400,000.
00:27:05
and we just added in the 200, we have the 288 that we put forward for ACE.
00:27:11
I'm not gonna trade, as much as I think the ACE program is valuable and serves a great purpose, I value our employees more and they need raises.
00:27:23
We need to keep our employees at market.
SPEAKER_02
00:27:26
Madam Chair, there's a few things that should be clarified about the list that was created.
00:27:31
If you reduce the tax rate, you're reducing ongoing revenue and not one time.
00:27:37
So the discussion about capital projects such as
00:27:43
I want to thank you all for being here today.
00:28:03
The Fifth Street project has 50,000 of ongoing money and that's as much as you could get out of that 120 some thousand because the rest is one time.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:28:12
We can take some of these and look at them as a board and figure what we want to do.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:28:17
I thought that the 288 we decided, 288,000 for the ACE that we decided we would put in this year but that that was a reoccurring figure because of the health care issue.
SPEAKER_02
00:28:30
But it's not going to ACE.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:28:32
No, it's not going to ACE in perpetuity, but if we were to take it out of ACE and there still is that next year.
00:28:43
I mean that money is there.
SPEAKER_02
00:28:45
Madam Chair, I just want to clarify.
00:28:46
You're technically correct.
00:28:48
I think the decision you're making
00:28:51
is to take the 288 and not put it towards the future deficit, which is what you decided to set it aside for in the future.
00:28:58
So you can eliminate ACE and the 17 money, but to have an ongoing effect, you'd also eliminate the 288 ongoing, which you had indicated was for reducing the future deficit.
00:29:11
So I just, I think it's important.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:29:12
You see that for salary.
00:29:14
I understand.
00:29:15
Because it raises the basis now, and then we're looking for it there.
SPEAKER_02
00:29:19
Again, depending on where you go, I think we will have to be sure that we calculate that properly for you because it's not all ongoing money.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:29:27
So, how would we like to do this?
00:29:30
We have pretty much a stalemate.
00:29:32
Norman, are you interested in changing your vote in any way?
SPEAKER_03
00:29:38
He voted for the tax rate.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:29:39
I know he did.
00:29:39
I'm talking about lowering it.
00:29:41
Would you vote for a lower tax rate?
00:29:45
because we could pass the tax rate and then figure out what to do about it later.
00:29:50
We do have that option if we can't come up with a solution today.
SPEAKER_11
00:30:04
Well, I guess I
00:30:07
I think Larry's strategy of let's see what we need to change, what's the minimal amount we need to change to get the tax rate.
00:30:15
The people on the board that voted to agree to the two and a half cent
00:30:22
Tax rate.
00:30:24
So we built the budget around that and we had discussions about what could happen and all and we ended up using the two and a half cent.
00:30:34
So I'm not clear, you know, what those board members that voted against, that voted for the two and a half cent maximum tax rate are now saying we need to cut the tax rate because they're only voting on the tax rate right now.
00:30:47
So how much do you three want to cut the tax rate?
00:30:51
I'd like to just hear that, not as a proposal necessarily, but are we talking about no tax increase or 2.25 instead of 2.5?
00:31:00
I don't think we can start talking about what we're going to cut if we have no idea how much we're trying to cut.
00:31:09
I think Rick has already answered that question.
SPEAKER_03
00:31:13
I've been publicly against, again, the sidewalk projects that I've identified in the past.
00:31:22
Last night I voted against the ACE funds.
00:31:26
I don't know how else to be.
SPEAKER_11
00:31:27
So how much would that take?
00:31:29
We have to vote on the tax rate, not on the sidewalk.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:31:32
$500,000 is what we've identified so far.
SPEAKER_11
00:31:37
Well, can Lori or somebody tell us if we took out the sidewalks and the...
00:31:43
The ACE program.
00:31:43
And the ACE program, how much... Well, and the transportation revenue sharing.
SPEAKER_03
00:31:47
And the revenue sharing, whatever it was.
SPEAKER_07
00:31:51
She can give us an idea.
00:31:52
So, just for clarity, so are you, just so I understand, when you say take out the sidewalks, it's every sidewalk project in the, I just wanna make sure I understand is all I'm asking.
SPEAKER_03
00:32:02
I've been against the Avon Street extended sidewalk project as well as the Pantops sidewalk projects.
00:32:11
My understanding is other projects are already moving forward so that you know I just I have an issue in general of building sidewalks when we are taking on
00:32:23
or we can't even pay the debt that we already have.
SPEAKER_07
00:32:27
So any of this, just to make sure I understand it correctly, any sidewalks that haven't already started construction or started down the way you'd like us to remove from the budget and when you say transportation revenue sharing, remove the 250 and maybe retarget the 250 from the change in the motor vehicle license and provide that over to the other part of the budget?
SPEAKER_03
00:32:51
I guess I'm not clear on how that money can be moved around.
00:32:54
My assumption was that if it was focused on a transportation project... Let me cover a couple things real quick.
SPEAKER_02
00:33:00
You all have a policy in place right now that transfers money to capital.
00:33:05
by policy.
00:33:07
So anything you cut in capital doesn't necessarily move it over to the general fund to reduce the tax rate unless you change that policy, and you certainly can do that.
00:33:18
The 250 is general fund revenue being generated from an increase in the decal fee, and it can be used directly to offset the tax rate if you want to reduce it.
00:33:29
So it doesn't have to be transferred to capital to pay for the match.
00:33:34
That's $250 a year that you definitely can free up for the goal.
00:33:37
The issue on reducing sidewalks is that that's coming out of a balance in the CIP that is generated from that $20 million transfer that we send over to the capital fund.
00:33:49
Generally speaking,
00:33:50
if the sidewalks aren't done it frees it up and it stays in the balance unless you then want to move it back over and of course you're only going to move over what is ongoing revenue so you'd have to cut some of that dedicated CIP money.
SPEAKER_03
00:34:04
In addition if you again look at the stormwater the point seven cents for stormwater that is funds that if that was reduced then your goals of funding general government and the schools could be achieved as well as the 288
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:34:21
If I'm mistaken something, please... You'll be laying off the inspectors who are... We would not be laying off the inspectors.
00:34:26
Yes, you will, because that's how they're paid for the last several years.
SPEAKER_03
00:34:30
I put my position out there.
00:34:31
I'm not going to vote for a tax increase that funds projects that I don't support.
00:34:37
It's as simple as that.
SPEAKER_02
00:34:39
Let me clarify that one point.
00:34:41
The point seven generates about 1.1 million dollars.
00:34:46
All but about 200,000 of that is going towards the ongoing operating expenses, which includes things like inspectors.
00:34:53
The remainder is going to the capital.
00:34:55
So you could stop that capital amount and if Trevor needs to clarify that he can but again the way we set these things up just want to make sure you know what's ongoing versus one times.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:35:05
And while you're there please explain how if that 200,000 is needed to leverage the money for the dam repair at Hollymead.
SPEAKER_00
00:35:14
Trevor Henry, Director of Facilities and Environmental Services.
00:35:19
I caught part of that so I might need to have Tom walk me back on that, but I just wanted to address if the board is considering stopping of existing projects that we have underway that are in either design or nearing construction that are funded via transportation revenue sharing,
00:35:37
Just as a reminder, that's matched funding.
00:35:40
So any money that we have spent towards that project that has been 50-50 shared with VDOT, the county would have to pay VDOT that equivalent amount.
00:35:52
I don't think I could in a real-time fashion tell you what's been spent where.
00:35:56
We have all that data.
00:35:57
It would take me a day or so to pull that together in a report, and I certainly can do that.
SPEAKER_02
00:36:03
some of those projects that are already under implementation.
SPEAKER_00
00:36:08
An example is Pantops State Farm Boulevard.
00:36:10
That is currently under contract for construction.
00:36:14
That project is tied with Crozet North sidewalk which is occurring as the first phase.
00:36:20
The Pantops work is scheduled for this fall.
00:36:23
But that's an example and I want to say that's a round of
00:36:26
$500,000 or so of work.
00:36:29
I have that more detailed information that I can provide.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:36:32
It's already been spent on those, getting them ready to go.
SPEAKER_00
00:36:34
The design money has been spent, yes ma'am.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:36:36
And when you say it's already under contract, that's the contractor who is going to build it.
SPEAKER_00
00:36:40
They're on site actually in Crozet.
00:36:44
They're on site in Crozet.
00:36:45
It's two projects that was tied together from a VDOT budgeting perspective.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:36:51
So that's a hard one to cut out, would be the Pantops one.
SPEAKER_00
00:36:55
It's a two-phase, the contract is written so there was two bids, two items.
00:37:01
We certainly could always do a change order to pull that out if that's the direction.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:37:06
But you'd have to repay the part that was from VDOT to go to the Pantops design?
SPEAKER_02
00:37:11
Yes ma'am.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:37:13
Several hundred thousand dollars, I'm guessing.
SPEAKER_02
00:37:15
If there's a, Madam Chair, if there's a place you're trying to get to,
00:37:22
We could also go about it that way and have staff figure out how to look at this list and figure out how to come up with that amount of money.
00:37:30
That may not be the way you want to proceed, but I will say that the other work session we have has a lot of our staff that are involved in doing the calculations of changes to this budget on the spur of the moment, so it would put us in a difficult spot.
00:37:45
If you said you wanted a half a cent, we might be able to try to
00:37:49
I don't want to cut off conversation.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:37:55
Absolutely.
00:37:57
And that's been suggested and rejected by some, but I think we're going to have to have some kind of compromise here just to get the tax rate done.
00:38:06
So I would like to ask those who have voted against the 2.5, what specific tax rate would you be willing to vote for?
00:38:16
Because we have to get through this.
00:38:17
We have to have some kind of compromise.
SPEAKER_02
00:38:20
Half cent is $800,000 roughly.
00:38:23
That would be the cuts we'd have to come up with.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:38:25
and 60% of that would be to the schools.
00:38:29
That would be reduced, the school transfer would be reduced by that amount.
SPEAKER_02
00:38:33
That would be the normal way that that would happen.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:38:36
So $800,000, one half a penny, do we have anybody who voted no on the 2.5 willing to vote for a half a penny less, two cents?
00:38:56
I'll speak at once.
00:39:03
We really honestly have to get through this.
00:39:05
We can't, this is legally we are going to have to adopt a tax rate today.
SPEAKER_05
00:39:11
I've tried to make myself very clear that I would like to see us get down lower than that.
00:39:17
And I do want to observe, Brad, that the total expenditure proposed in the CIP for sidewalk construction, when you take those one, two, three, four, five, six, seven projects, comes to a whopping $327,311, which is
00:39:36
far below what would be proposed for the Senior Center on a four-year basis per annum for support of that.
00:39:46
So that, I agree with you, it's not an insignificant amount, but it's not a huge amount.
00:39:53
And one of the reasons why I was advocating for taking a penny out via removing 1%
00:40:01
on employees' salary was because that would, in essence, generate for us $1.6 million, which would equal the penny.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:40:14
So what you're saying is you would vote for a one and a half cent increase.
00:40:19
Yes.
00:40:19
And Ann, what would you vote for?
00:40:22
I would vote for that as well, assuming that it could come out, because that's why I was framing it based upon the raise, but if it can't be allocated to the raise, then I'll have to vote.
00:40:41
I like the idea of figuring out what people will actually vote for at this point with respect to a tax rate and then have staff go out and figure out what they think is the best way to come down to that.
SPEAKER_03
00:40:54
If I could be clear about my sidewalk suggestion is that there are funds that have been appropriated to date that could be shifted to
00:41:05
So yes, the column for FY17 adds up to a minuscule amount, but the funds that have not been spent on some of these sidewalk projects could be reallocated, reappropriated, that equal millions of dollars.
00:41:22
So that's my contention.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:41:25
And that minuscule amount is just a little bit less than what the raises would be for county government employees if we left it at 2% rather than reducing it to 1%.
SPEAKER_02
00:41:34
We would have to determine how much of the sidewalk money is one time versus ongoing.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:41:41
Brad, would you be willing to pick a number, a tax rate that you would vote for and let staff decide what the best way is to make those cuts?
00:41:53
Would that be something you would be willing to consider?
SPEAKER_11
00:41:55
Or give us information, at least, not make the decision.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:41:59
Well, no, we can ask for their opinion.
00:42:04
It's not passing the buck.
00:42:06
It's letting those who
00:42:09
are doing the budgeting, pick out what they think is most appropriate to cut.
SPEAKER_11
00:42:15
Well, I'll just say, Brad, that in terms of the sidewalk issues, I think we pretty much agree on that.
00:42:20
I've kind of felt like the train already left the station, that we've already committed to this, but to the extent that we can still do something when we're dealing with a capital improvement budgets coming up, you know, I would
00:42:35
to give you my support on most of the things, just because I don't think that current neighborhood modeling and neighborhood, you know, all the kind of things we think we're for in Phil, I don't think the sidewalks are really appropriate for that, so I'd like to reallocate that money to other community things.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:42:52
So the sidewalks I think of as one-time money, but you're talking about ongoing appropriation.
SPEAKER_03
00:42:59
We have long-term issues that Tom has identified that
00:43:03
even reducing salaries is not going to solve because at some point we're going to have to either tell county staff that they will be paid below market or we'll have to bring ourselves back up to market someday and we faced that a couple years ago.
00:43:20
I believe this board had to make the hard decision of raising the tax rate to get our employees back up to market.
00:43:27
So no matter what decisions we make tonight,
00:43:29
We are going to be faced with this decision next year and the year after because unless we give direction to staff to cut services, we will not balance our budgets.
00:43:42
So in long term services, unless you all believe
00:43:47
Assessments are going to go up double digits, which right now I'm not going to gamble on any assessment increases beyond 2%.
00:43:54
And so this board or future boards got to find what tax rate and economic development sustains the expectations of this community.
00:44:07
And so I'm in a bad place because I hate making these kind of recommendations, but I
00:44:17
I'm conflicted with the fact that we have projects that I don't support that are getting funded that are pulling us down as an anchor right now.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:44:26
This board right now is hiring new employees as we always do but we certainly are hiring new employees and this board has been very insistent on making sure that we're paying market for those folks.
00:44:43
I think we ought to be paying market for all of our employees because and that's what the 2% represents.
00:44:49
Matter of fact the recommendation that we have in our budget at 2% is lower than the world at work figures which were 3% that we got from Lorna Jerome and as you're seeing these
00:45:03
raises rolling out for groups that are comparable markets, you are hearing two and three and 3.5%.
00:45:12
So that's not outrageous.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:45:14
So Tom, if we were to take sidewalk projects, this is money out of the capital, the CIP money, and put that into operating,
00:45:25
What would that look like?
00:45:28
Could you give us just a little more information on removing that from the CIP and putting it in operating?
SPEAKER_02
00:45:34
The only way to answer that would be to determine how much of the cost of those projects was equity versus borrowed monies.
00:45:45
There's a challenge in giving you a definite number on that, but I think the best way to think about that is the decal fee increase generated 250,000.
00:45:55
That is absolutely ongoing money that you could effect a change on.
00:46:00
and it would effectively not bring down the transportation revenue sharing dollars from the state which would affect the sidewalk program going forward.
00:46:09
So if there's questions about the sidewalk program, then adding 250 to it in essence this year is probably not a great idea.
00:46:20
That would free up 250 and let me give you a quick sense of this.
00:46:24
If you cut the tax rate a half a cent, local government will have to come up with 298,000
00:46:31
schools would have to come up with 448,000 and the CIP would be reduced by 79,000.
00:46:37
That's according to the formula that's in place.
00:46:42
Obviously you all could do it differently if you wanted to.
00:46:45
That would mean based on the decisions you've made on local government expenditures, you'd have to come up with about 300,000, 250 of that,
00:46:56
could be to reallocate the decal fee increase to reduce the tax rate.
00:47:02
And then you'd only need another 50,000.
SPEAKER_03
00:47:03
Could you go over those numbers again?
SPEAKER_02
00:47:05
Sure.
00:47:05
Sorry.
00:47:06
298,000 and some change for local government, 448,000 and some change for schools, and 79,000 that wouldn't go to the CIP from that half cent.
00:47:20
That total's just about $800,000.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:47:23
So if we were going to take more out of the CIP that would have gone to sidewalks, you're saying you can't really answer that at this point because you're not sure how much is equity and how much is, how long would it take, if, let me just ask this one question.
00:47:38
Brad, are you trying to get one penny off or are you trying to get more than that off?
SPEAKER_03
00:47:45
I'll kind of clarify my answer.
00:47:48
I'm not looking at the tax rate as much as the projects that I don't support.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:47:53
Would you be willing if we could post some of those?
SPEAKER_03
00:47:55
My estimation is that we don't have to increase the tax rate.
00:48:02
But I could be wrong and so I can't give you a clear answer because if I'm wrong about the sidewalk numbers and I see Trevor over there on his laptop and I'm sure he's looking at those.
00:48:16
So yeah, I don't know what to tell you.
SPEAKER_02
00:48:18
I'll say this.
00:48:21
If you want less money to go over to the CIP to pay for sidewalks we can reduce the transfer to the capital fund.
00:48:30
What generally that would do is it would shift
00:48:33
money from sidewalks to some other unmet capital need.
00:48:37
So the only way to affect that change is to transfer less from general fund to capital fund.
00:48:42
And again, you could reduce sidewalks to help solve that.
00:48:47
But the 250 is an automatic amount that is easily incorporated that will have an effect on sidewalks.
SPEAKER_03
00:48:54
And the remaining out of that 1.7 million, that
SPEAKER_02
00:48:59
That's a half a penny by the way, it's 800,000.
00:49:01
Those numbers I gave you was a total of 800,000 which is equivalent to half of a penny.
SPEAKER_03
00:49:10
The 1.7 million transportation revenue sharing line item in the capital budget.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:49:15
Everything but 250 of that is borrowed money.
00:49:18
That's what Trevor explained.
00:49:19
It's not cash in the box.
00:49:21
It's $250,000 decal money leveraged against what we can borrow, and then it's matched by the state.
00:49:29
So it's not a bucket.
00:49:30
I was looking for a bucket of 101.7.
00:49:32
Trevor.
SPEAKER_07
00:49:34
Lindsay's here that could clarify that.
00:49:36
Lindsay does do that work, unless Trevor would like to.
SPEAKER_02
00:49:39
Yeah, Trevor, why don't you go ahead and clarify.
SPEAKER_00
00:49:43
I apologize if I have not explained it better or if there's confusion, but the $250,000 that would come from that increase in the decal fee, that cash would be the source of funding to cover the debt.
00:49:58
So the $1.7 million... Would be borrowing the $1.7 million.
00:50:01
Yes, sir, yes.
00:50:02
So that's the offset.
00:50:04
and actually the 250 is to cover the year one and two together for 3.4 total over the two years.
00:50:14
The debt service for that will be covered by the 250 annually.
SPEAKER_07
00:50:20
Lindsay has some additional information on that that she could share to clarify the full amount of the 1.7.
00:50:25
This is Lindsay Harris, by the way, our senior budget analyst.
SPEAKER_01
00:50:35
So of the 1.7 in each, that's the total across both fiscal years, in each fiscal year there's 250,000 that's in equity.
00:50:47
So the first two years it would be 250,000.
00:50:49
And then the years after that 250,000 goes towards the debt service.
SPEAKER_03
00:50:54
Yeah, I understand it better now, which doesn't help my mindset because I'm having issues with taking on more debt when we are struggling paying for the debt that we have.
SPEAKER_02
00:51:05
So if you want to balance this budget by moving that decal money over to reduce the tax rate, the whole conversation about sidewalks going forward and how important they are compared to other things would be part of the May discussion.
00:51:21
In order to balance the budget today, if you're looking for strategies, that 250 would get us most of the way there on local government.
00:51:30
And in the stormwater, which you mentioned, there is $50,000 in money that goes transferred to the capital part of stormwater that
00:51:41
could make up the difference of that.
00:51:44
We would reduce the .7 by whatever the equivalent amount is, effectively reducing the tax rate by the half a cent.
00:51:53
So if you're looking for a strategy that's pretty straight up that gets at wanting to discuss sidewalks,
00:51:59
taking that 250 out as a match and most of that money's going to sidewalks is a good way to say let's put a stop on this and figure out how this fits into the big picture.
00:52:08
The stormwater, we just happen to be in a position because the band-aids aren't as strong.
00:52:15
But we do have to pay for our operating expense unless you want to free some positions or vacancies.
00:52:21
But again, you can get the 300,000 through those two means.
00:52:26
I think without having some dramatic impact.
00:52:29
The stormwater issue is one that is before you even next month to talk about utility fees as an alternative, but certainly we would want to reevaluate all the ongoing expenses for the stormwater program as a part of going forward anyway.
00:52:43
So that's just a possibility on this.
00:52:47
Again, that does require some reductions in the school and it will reduce some monies from the CIP, which we'll have to then make some final adjustments to.
00:52:57
But it would get us to a resolution that you could consider approving.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:53:01
Brad, would you be interested in moving the sidewalk funding to the school's CIP?
00:53:07
If those projects are not, you know, you could move the sidewalk funding in the CIP, which is what we're talking about, to the school's CIP project.
00:53:20
you were saying you don't support the project and I have to say I voted against some of the sidewalk project as well but yeah but I mean does that help at all?
SPEAKER_03
00:53:28
The basis for me not supporting sidewalk projects is because that's not where I think I don't think we're prepared to spend money on capital but if you moved it to the school side then it would still be spending the money you would be spending it wouldn't be those projects that I know you support school I guess I should be clear I don't I don't like spending money on non-essential capital projects that
00:53:51
when we're having difficulty balancing the budget.
00:53:54
So this is one of the reasons why I haven't brought up the Pantops fire station is because my discussions with staff is that if we don't build it, we are going to run into issues.
00:54:06
So yeah, the nonessential capital projects need to be taken off the table.
00:54:13
if that is a better way to term it.
SPEAKER_05
00:54:17
I applaud you for trying to prioritize these capital projects and I agree with you.
00:54:21
We're in a situation where we need to trade off what we think are valuable projects from what are essential projects.
00:54:29
And clearly Pantops is an essential for the fire station.
00:54:33
But I do think the idea of trading off here for sidewalks is something I agree with you.
00:54:39
It's appropriate under these circumstances.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:54:43
Just from the big picture, it does seem like to me that this whole discussion is really very sad and it's almost a race to the bottom.
00:54:52
And I really find that we're not talking about or prioritizing or being willing to fund and show the public what our vision is for this county.
00:55:06
In anything we cut this year,
00:55:09
and what we don't support this year is gonna come back to haunt us in spades next year and the year after.
00:55:16
And I understand politically that it's really hard to raise taxes.
00:55:22
But we are in a structural imbalance.
00:55:26
We're not going to have double-digit property assessments next year.
00:55:32
And I am just,
00:55:37
very saddened that we're talking about putting our employees at risk and I think that's talking about taking their salary increases away puts them at risk.
00:55:48
It puts the organization at risk and it is a race to the bottom.
00:55:56
And I just find the whole conversation very sad.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:56:02
You know the other thing that I'm really we've heard many many many times is that the actual payment that people are paying for the most part when you correct for inflation is pretty much the same as they were ten years ago sure there's some people who are paying more but the vast majority of our county are paying the same thing they were ten years ago and I recognize that we have people that can't afford this
00:56:30
but we have an awful lot of people out there that can't afford us not to do it and that's why I'm willing to go ahead and vote for this.
00:56:41
If we look at the people, the communities around us, we are operating on a lower tax rate than the communities around us and I think we have to say we've done a pretty good job up to this point dealing with that.
00:56:54
and we have to find solutions and maybe the priority-based budgeting is going to get us there.
00:57:01
I don't think it's going to get us all the way there.
00:57:03
I just don't.
00:57:05
I think the more people that come here, the less services we're going to have to give them because the less money if we don't agree on some tax rate increases and some really, really serious attempts to deal with
00:57:21
our state and our tax structure.
00:57:26
And I know that people have been doing it for years and it's just getting worse and worse but at some point all the other communities in Virginia are going to be screaming just like we are.
00:57:38
So I just wish that we could this time take our county executive's budget as proposed, go to our priority-paced budgeting sessions and strategic planning and really get down and figure out either what we're going to cut or how much we're going to increase the tax rate as we go forward over the years.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
00:58:01
Race to the bottom gets this county nowhere.
00:58:07
and it just kicks the can down the road and we'll have to deal with it eventually.
SPEAKER_05
00:58:13
We're trying to avoid kicking a can down the road but a 2.5 cent increase we're talking about you've shared that you feel the county's in a structural imbalance we've used that term but we've also heard from members of the public they're in a structural imbalance
00:58:29
I mean they have not had the pay increases that even though yes we're in agreement we're back to where we were in 07 or 08 but the reality is there are people really hurting out there and they've told us that they're hurting and
00:58:45
we're between a rock and a hard place.
00:58:48
And there have been decisions made in the past that are influencing where we are here today.
00:58:55
We did not bring ourselves here.
00:58:57
This board did not bring us here today.
00:59:01
It's been brought here by decisions that were made in the past.
00:59:06
CIP that was not funded during the near depression.
00:59:11
No money was put into it and yet depreciation
00:59:15
of property continued to occur.
00:59:18
And the argument was we couldn't burden people with additional taxes, but we didn't maintain our CIP.
00:59:26
Now the chickens have come home to roost.
00:59:29
And so we can't have it all anymore.
00:59:32
And I understand your point.
00:59:33
Isn't it wonderful to be able to maintain all the employees at the 75% percentile?
00:59:39
We're not the only county in this position.
00:59:43
It would be nice to maintain them all at the 75th.
00:59:51
It would be nice to do that at 7550.
00:59:58
It would be nice.
01:00:01
It would be my preference to move it higher.
01:00:03
than that.
01:00:04
But we can't do that.
01:00:06
And we have to embrace a notion, I believe, of shared sacrifice to get out of this situation.
01:00:13
And it isn't a race to the bottom, it's a race for survival here and to provide a budget that's going to be realistic, fiscally prudent, that we can move forward and maintain vital functions
01:00:26
Go into May and have a discussion about what are our strategic priorities moving forward as a county because we can't do it all the way we've done it in the past.
01:00:39
We have to do it differently.
01:00:41
But we can't do that here today.
01:00:43
We've just got to come up with some way of reaching agreement.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:00:45
I've been actually trying to get that program service review discussion into this discussion for February and March and I'm sorry we didn't do it because it would have solved, we would have done a lot of things that would have made a lot of zeros of difference going forward.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:00:58
I think what we need is a tax rate right now.
01:01:00
I don't think we're going to figure out how we're going to pull out.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:03
Is anybody interested in doing the 2% raise at half year time instead?
01:01:08
which we have done in the past to get us to market but have some savings for the first half year to help to reduce cost.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:17
For county government that's $400,000.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:19
With commonality it would need to be for everybody.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:23
you're talking about for schools and county government.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:25
I think that's the only way that it works.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:01:27
I would not be in favor of that.
SPEAKER_11
01:01:30
As long as I can make a comment about the cost, though, of the salaries, that in my experience in business, but I think it's true just on a macro sense, there is a cost to not giving raises.
01:01:40
It's not just that we're saving 2%.
01:01:43
What happens inevitably is the most valuable employees that have other alternatives leave
01:01:49
and employees, and I'm not criticizing any one person, this is just an overall economic certainty that if you pay under market, you get under market value for what you're paying for.
01:02:03
So it's not a matter of shared sacrifice, it's a matter of are we willing to pay for good employees.
01:02:11
You know, I've often said I'd rather have one really good, you know, $15 employee is worth three $10 employee, I mean, this is years ago now, but, you know, three $10 employees that don't hustle or don't, you know, do the job that they're supposed to do.
01:02:26
So, to me, adding 2% to our budget, yes, that's an immediate on-paper increase in cost, but in reality, we're going to lose a lot of effectiveness in our government if we continue to bleed the best people that can find better jobs.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:02:40
and 1% this year and 2% or 2%, it starts to add up and then all of a sudden, you're just pushing the can down the road because then you find yourself, this county has been there before.
01:02:54
We have been so far behind in market that Norman's right, we can't hire the great people, we can't keep the good employees and then you're struggling to not come up with 2% but to come up with a much larger number that is much more painful.
SPEAKER_02
01:03:12
Madam Chair, if you all have a goal in mind, I think that certainly from- We'd love to have a goal in mind.
01:03:20
If it's a half a cent, I think that the way to least affect services and staff is to put off the decision about the future sidewalk program by not moving that decal fee over.
01:03:37
I know you're not gonna get a match from the state and it has an impact.
01:03:40
Since there's some questions about how we go forward on a sidewalk program when we have other fairly dramatic needs, I think staff would feel that that was a good alternative.
01:03:51
If the schools are going to be asked to come up with some reductions as well, I think you probably
01:04:00
would think that they might second guess funding their share of the SRO, but that's a school board position, decision to be made.
01:04:11
So the 250 gets you most of the way there and you need another 50,000.
01:04:15
The SRO for local government would be about 45,000.
01:04:20
as another alternative, as I already mentioned, the stormwater money could get that other $50,000 and not impact the program.
01:04:27
It would just be less money that would transfer over to the capital project side of it.
01:04:32
There is a balance in stormwater, so it's not gonna stop our program.
01:04:35
$50,000 is not gonna be a dramatic issue, and you do have the whole issue about stormwater fees coming to make a decision on.
01:04:42
So those would be the two things that I would throw out as consideration.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:04:46
The two things, I thought there were three things.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:04:48
What were you mentioning?
01:04:49
Tell me again.
SPEAKER_02
01:04:50
One and then an alternative being SRO or the storm water to take care of the other part.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:04:55
What does the ACE do for us?
01:04:56
288.
01:04:57
That's 288,000.
01:05:02
It also draws down a state match.
SPEAKER_02
01:05:03
Since you called it ace, I would say that won't solve the reducing the tax rate.
01:05:07
If you mean taking it away from the ongoing, you could get the other amount there for sure.
01:05:12
Yes, absolutely.
01:05:12
And then you have to just make that up next year when you look at FY18.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:05:15
We are gonna have to make up any cuts or reductions that we make, including salary reductions will have to be made up next year for the most part, because we're talking about cutting services and employee raises that
01:05:31
ultimately will come back to haunt us.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:05:33
And we're not even addressing the compression issue this year.
01:05:38
Exactly.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:05:39
And I can tell you that I will not support reduction in salaries unless we add back in the compression.
01:05:47
Because we were talking about a 2% but weren't dealing with compression for folks.
01:05:53
And to not have either one of those would be a huge mistake.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:05:58
I think, what was the compression?
01:06:00
I think it was, I thought it was 470, but anyway.
SPEAKER_07
01:06:03
388,000, something like that.
01:06:04
In my mind, I think it's two to three for local government, just off the top of my head.
01:06:09
I think maybe the total was, I'm not sure.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:06:13
But we didn't even address compression.
01:06:15
When Norman talks about keeping great folks, we're losing people right now.
01:06:20
I mean, we could list
01:06:24
people that have left for higher salaries or people that applied for jobs that we wanted to hire that looked at our salaries and said no thank you.
01:06:35
So we're talking about a race to the bottom with this right now.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:06:39
I have a proposal.
01:06:43
The comment before is I'm sorry that I voted for the transfer out of capital last year, and I think the penny we're putting into capital this year basically replaces the money we took away last year, which always troubles me.
01:06:56
But I will support 2% if we can get to four with that.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:07:02
I'm sorry, you will support 2%?
SPEAKER_11
01:07:06
2%, not percent.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:07:08
I'm sorry, 2% increase on the tax rate, yes.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:07:11
You will support that.
01:07:12
Now, and what are we saying, what that two cents is gonna...
01:07:17
I think we should.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:07:17
Was based upon the numbers that Tom gave.
01:07:20
Gave, okay.
SPEAKER_02
01:07:22
So the decal fee shifting to reduce the tax rate would be one component, and you all would have to decide on how you wanna get the balance of that, which is roughly $50,000.
01:07:33
There's, taking it away from the ongoing healthcare reduction, which one time money was going to ACE,
01:07:41
there's the SRO or the stormwater amount.
01:07:45
Either of those three, I think, would be ways to do that without any significant impacts on service.
SPEAKER_11
01:07:51
The SRO, it's kind of all or nothing.
01:07:53
We can't take 25,000 out of it, right?
01:07:56
Yeah, I mean, if you took your money, I mean, we could take it out of stormwater or ace, but if we took 25,000 each out of stormwater and ace, plus the decal.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:08:08
The CIP category is probably the most reasonable.
SPEAKER_05
01:08:12
Yeah.
01:08:13
Why don't we look for areas where we have the greatest degree of agreement made.
01:08:18
That's what we're trying to do.
01:08:19
And build forward from that so that we'll basically build a half a penny.
SPEAKER_03
01:08:26
A real question before that, Rick.
01:08:29
When you talk about the reduction by a half penny, that still means the schools have to find
SPEAKER_02
01:08:35
They'd have to come up with $448,000.
SPEAKER_03
01:08:36
Well, in asking them to fund the SR.
01:08:38
The healthcare savings, that's half of what they're getting out of that.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:08:44
Which is one-time money they're supposed to be using, so that's fine.
SPEAKER_03
01:08:47
I just wanted to make sure that was clear.
SPEAKER_11
01:08:53
could you repeat that I mean health care savings and how we get to the half cent what you know what's the seems like we're agreeing on you're not referring to the school issue but the overall issue right yeah that the not
SPEAKER_02
01:09:09
Raising the decal fee but not allocating that to the CIP for the sidewalk program, but leaving it in the general fund so that you can reduce the tax rate would be the major component of that.
01:09:21
That would take care of 250 of about 300,000 that local government would need.
01:09:26
and then you have several options on how to get the other 50,000.
01:09:29
The simplest one is probably the storm water or the health care savings.
SPEAKER_11
01:09:38
All things being equal, it would be nice if we didn't give up money that was being matched.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:09:43
Yeah, that's where the ACE and the revenue sharing are in that match category.
SPEAKER_02
01:09:50
Well then ACE is the other option.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:09:53
ACE needs to be the one that I would support.
SPEAKER_02
01:09:55
Let's call that healthcare savings because you want it on an ongoing basis to reduce the tax rate and that of course would impact
01:10:03
Ace by 50,000 of the 288.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:10:07
But remember folks, last year we ended up with a lot more in Ace than we anticipated because the state was able to give us more than we anticipated.
01:10:13
Again, you take 50,000.
01:10:16
Well, that would be one year.
SPEAKER_02
01:10:17
50,000 would come from, on an ongoing basis, would come from what you had targeted to reduce the deficit.
01:10:25
And 50,000 would also come out of the one-time money for Ace.
01:10:29
So the effect is 288 for ACE would go down to 238.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:10:34
That seems reasonable.
01:10:35
That seems reasonable to me.
SPEAKER_02
01:10:37
And that gets you the 300,000 that you need for the local government share of a reduction of a half cent on the tax rate.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:10:45
Now I'm very concerned about what that give me the impact specifically on schools.
SPEAKER_02
01:10:52
The schools would have to come up with $448,000 and I think as Mr. Dill said or I think Mr. Sheffield said that that $448,000
01:11:04
could come from the healthcare savings, is in essence what you said, and that generated about 887.
01:11:09
Now that doesn't.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:11:09
Jackson is nodding his head or saying no, that that couldn't happen.
01:11:13
Jackson, could you come forward?
01:11:14
I'd like Jackson to address it.
01:11:16
Could you come forward, Jackson?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:11:17
Other one-time monies that they can use to cover it.
01:11:20
Or Dean.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:11:21
Dean, either one.
01:11:22
I just saw Jackson shaking his head no.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:11:24
Well, we had agreement, but it's not there now.
SPEAKER_04
01:11:28
Where my confusion lay is the tax rate increase, 2.5 cents a penny to capital, 1.5 to operating, 1.1 dedicated to county, 0.4 dedicated to schools, 0.4 equals about $660,000.
01:11:43
You're now proposing to take $448,000 of that as giving us a 60% share of a cut, which we didn't get in the first place.
01:11:52
So if I think about the dedication port, I think you'd have one penny, it'd be dedicated .9 to county and .1 to schools.
01:12:03
That's where we'd be, we'd have to come up with the money.
01:12:05
$450,000 roughly in cuts.
01:12:09
And I don't know where the board would get that.
01:12:12
They could get it, but I don't know where.
SPEAKER_03
01:12:14
Until, when do we vote on the 1.1, is it yesterday?
01:12:19
Oh, blur these.
01:12:20
Until yesterday, that $887,000 didn't exist.
SPEAKER_04
01:12:24
We have a $1.7 million deficit until you decide or not decide the 0.4 dedicated to schools, which closed it to the 1.1, which then the $887,000.
01:12:35
But until there's a 0.4 dedicated, our gap is 1.7, which the healthcare closed by half of it.
SPEAKER_03
01:12:41
which I understand that perspective and as staff reminds me from time to time, if we put everything on the table, we would have a deficit as well in the county.
01:12:53
I'm trying to look at it from a more positive standpoint.
SPEAKER_04
01:12:55
I'm just trying to get some clarity around the tax rate implications of this.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:12:58
So help me out because I'm a little bit confused.
01:13:01
You're concerned about actually getting the .4 out of a two cent increase.
SPEAKER_04
01:13:08
Well it's hard to say we're going to get a dedicated 0.4 to begin with and now we're going to get 60% of a reduction of a half.
01:13:17
So I'm just trying to clarify, if you do a 1.0 tax rate increase instead of 1.5, and since you didn't do a 60% separation in the first place,
01:13:28
To me it equates to roughly a 0.9 dedicated to county and 0.1 dedicated.
01:13:32
I'm not arguing for it gets it, I'm just trying to make sure there's clarity around what you seem to be talking about.
SPEAKER_02
01:13:37
I think Dean Dean's right on the way of looking at that because the 1.5 only 0.4 of it was for schools so for them to take an equal share based on the 60-40 is actually is probably more than it should be and frankly
01:13:52
We're in that place right now where we're doing this on the fly instead of in the work sessions at the last moment.
01:13:57
So we would need some time for you all to let us calculate this so we don't make a decision that impacts them more than it probably should based on where you're trying to go.
SPEAKER_11
01:14:07
Is that going to change the amount that you were just saying that we just kind of agreed to or is that a separate issue?
SPEAKER_02
01:14:14
I think it's the amount of reductions the school would have to take.
01:14:17
We're going to have to take the percentage 0.4 is of 1.5.
SPEAKER_11
01:14:22
I think and calculate that in terms of this reduction to get to the number you're trying to get we want to keep the balance the same I think we're all agreeing that right it's just that we're we're not doing it in our heads right but in the end we we're not suggesting to change the percentage that goes to the school.
01:14:40
Madam Chair if you'd like to give us an opportunity for a recess we could calculate it probably but it's up to you.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:14:46
Would you like to do that or
SPEAKER_03
01:14:48
Well, while they're doing that, I think Rick had a good point about finding the common ground and building from there.
01:14:54
So while staff's working on that, at least giving some sense of common ground, because I talk about eliminating sidewalks, but only three people may agree on that.
01:15:05
So I don't want to have staff working.
SPEAKER_02
01:15:09
At least figuring out if the decal issue is on the table for the local government.
01:15:12
and I guess we'll have to, staff has brought to my attention that the decal fee is a general fund revenue and according to the formula, that would also be a 60-40 split.
01:15:26
So in addition, unless it's used for capital, but since it was going to capital, it was 100% dedicated, as we pull it out of capital, you probably need to apply the 60-40.
01:15:36
So again, love to do these things when we're in work sessions, but if you'll give us an opportunity
01:15:42
We want to make sure we get this right.
01:15:44
Certainly aren't trying to do anything that would affect the schools more than it should based on what was originally proposed.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:15:50
If you could go ahead and do that.
01:15:52
I do and you can go ahead and start.
01:15:55
I just want to make sure that we're clear on what we're talking about at this point before we take a recess.
01:16:00
How about that?
01:16:02
So we're talking about the $250,000 for the
01:16:05
DeKalb, we've got to figure out the school piece.
01:16:08
And we're talking about 50,000 from ACE.
01:16:10
And again, we'll have to make sure that we're dealing with the schools properly.
01:16:15
That only gives us the 300,000 that we're trying to get for local government.
01:16:21
Schools don't get 450.
01:16:24
We would have four votes for a two percent increase under those circumstances.
01:16:30
Is this
01:16:47
This is a huge waste of the bottom.
01:16:49
So if we are going to affect the schools in such a way, if they're going to have, that doesn't get us our $300,000 essentially is what it doesn't do.
01:16:59
So we have to have something else to go in there.
SPEAKER_02
01:17:02
You didn't mention storm water in that.
01:17:04
I think I can come up with our amount without much trouble given that $190,000 is not needed for the operating expenses of storm water.
01:17:14
and it's only going into a capital fund for stormwater that's already funding the projects going forward.
01:17:19
I think if that's in a way you want to look at it and I can look at these other two also but I think I've got to talk with staff to really get to the right place.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:17:28
See what you can do as far as schools to get them in a better position than having to, than being close to four, five hundred thousand dollars in the whole.
SPEAKER_02
01:17:35
So the only thing I can, let me just clarify.
01:17:38
I don't think I can come up with some, dream up with some idea.
01:17:44
What we're going to do is calculate the even accurate amount based on the reduction.
01:17:49
So everybody gets an equal share the way they're supposed to.
01:17:52
Beyond that, that's something you all have.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:17:53
And when people can start thinking about what else they're going to cut.
01:17:56
And this would not take Brad's sidewalks out that he does not support.
01:18:00
So you would have to... Is that part of the CIP though that we're talking about later?
01:18:05
But it doesn't take all the sidewalks out.
SPEAKER_11
01:18:07
Can we do that at the CIP?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:18:11
I'm just trying to clarify, because he's voting against a particular project.
SPEAKER_03
01:18:16
Yeah, but it affects the tax rate that we would set, because if we set a tax rate at 82 and a half cents, then where does that penny at one point, I don't know, try to do all this and fly that, .6 go, you know, it's,
01:18:37
so if there's two million dollars in sidewalk projects that can be installed or terminated or whatever and it's a wash based on what Trevor's saying we have to you know pay back some of the reimbursed money and things like that you know we have to pay a hundred percent of the cost then that's two million dollars in the CIP that can be moved around and that's essentially let's say it's 1.6 million that's a penny of the tax rate so hopefully that clarifies
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:19:07
All right, let's take a 10 or 15 minute break.
SPEAKER_02
01:19:11
And let me make sure after all that conversation.
01:19:14
Are we still shooting for a half a cent?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:19:15
I think we're shooting for a half a cent.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:19:18
Just find out what the facts are regarding what you find out.
SPEAKER_03
01:19:21
And I guess right before we take every sense, I guess I'm not clear about why we would, so the decal fee, $250,000, what you're saying has a 60% correlating impact on schools.
SPEAKER_02
01:19:37
because it's coming out of capital.
01:19:38
They would get 60% of that 250 if it doesn't go to capital.
SPEAKER_03
01:19:42
Oh, okay, I thought it was the other way around, that if we take away the 250, we're also taking away equipment.
01:19:46
I thought that's what he said, too.
01:19:48
Yeah, so, okay.
SPEAKER_02
01:19:48
And I apologize for the confusion, but the idea here is any money that is general fund money that's supposed to be shared, if it goes to capital, neither of us get it.
SPEAKER_03
01:19:56
Unless we specify the actual penny to government schools.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:20:00
That is dedicated.
01:20:01
Well, schools are getting .4 of the 1.5 cent
SPEAKER_02
01:20:05
Yeah, we have all that.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:20:07
And that's nowhere near the 60-40 split.
01:20:09
That's what they're gonna work on.
01:20:11
So you're gonna work on that?
SPEAKER_03
01:20:12
Yeah, and my point was, what they're saying now, and clarified, is that if we take the 250 out of capital, bring it back over to general fund, based on our current policy, we would have to share 60% with the schools.
01:20:24
But we can, as a board, say that that 250, whatever the equivalent penny is, is dedicated to general fund or whatever.
SPEAKER_02
01:20:31
You could say it's just dedicated to reducing the tax rate, but then we have to calculate the 0.4, so.
SPEAKER_03
01:20:35
Which you could still go to schools or whatever, but it would just, I'm very clear on that.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:20:41
Schools are already not getting $60,000.
SPEAKER_03
01:20:43
Well, that's a philosophical debate that we could have that the county government's not getting funded needs as well, so.
01:20:51
It's not about who's getting what.
01:20:53
It's about trying to find the balance of what the community can sustain and what will, I guess, get us a little bit further down the road.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:21:04
Well, I don't disagree.
01:21:05
I'm just trying to make sure the schools aren't in a worse position after all of this discussion.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:21:09
And what it essentially means is we have to come up with more than 300,000.
01:21:13
That's me.
SPEAKER_02
01:21:15
If you reduce the tax rate by a half a cent, the schools will be in a worse position.
01:21:21
as will the local government in terms of what they were hoping to fund.
01:21:26
Let's get a break.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:21:32
How much would you like in time, guys?
01:21:36
Okay, 15 minutes, so we'll be back here at 20 of five.
01:21:43
All right, so I think we can get started again, I believe.
01:21:48
I've had a request from a supervisor, Larry.
01:21:56
I've had a request from a supervisor.
01:21:58
I'm not sure that this is
01:22:01
I'm not quite sure that it's even on the table.
01:22:04
I'm still a little bit confused, but could you comment on the issue of the contracts about the sidewalk contracts?
SPEAKER_06
01:22:15
Well, there are a number of projects that were approved in the FY16 capital budget that involved revenue sharing as well as
01:22:32
other county funds that have been appropriated in the FY16 budget.
01:22:38
In reliance upon that approved capital plan and the appropriated money, the county has entered into contracts for the construction of some of those projects.
01:22:51
Those contracts are binding legal agreements.
01:22:55
and canceling those contracts would have implications of the county being in violation and default of a binding legal agreement which could result in damages if those contracts were pursued.
01:23:10
In addition, those contracts were in reliance upon revenue sharing money from the VDOT in which we have agreements with VDOT.
01:23:19
The consequence, as Trevor mentioned earlier, with VDOT is that for any funds that have been expended that were to be matching funds, VDOT revenue sharing money, for a project that's not completed, we are under obligation to
01:23:37
to reimburse VDOT for all of those expenses that they might have incurred.
01:23:42
That could be to the tune, and the exact numbers aren't out there, but to half a million dollars of funds that have been, over a million dollars we think has been spent on various aspects of those revenue sharing projects, and half of that would be an obligation that we would have to pay to VDOT if we don't complete those projects.
01:24:02
So it would be money that would be spent for an uncompleted project.
01:24:09
So there are consequences to dealing with those projects.
01:24:16
It also would have an impact going forward
01:24:21
on future revenue sharing opportunities because when you cancel contracts, that's taken into account in future revenue sharing decisions as to whether or not VDOT will fund us in the future for revenue sharing.
01:24:34
So there's potential consequences going forward outside of this current fiscal year.
01:24:40
So I would
01:24:41
suggest to you that that's not a good strategy to use for balancing future budgets by taking money away from FY16 approved and appropriated contracted projects.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:24:55
And would the $250,000 from the decal program as ongoing money affect that in any way?
SPEAKER_06
01:25:02
The $250,000 from the decal money
01:25:06
is simply a funding source for funding debt service going forward for revenue sharing projects.
01:25:14
So that would allow us to borrow money to match the state for revenue sharing purposes and to pay the debt service for that.
01:25:26
that was a funding idea that came from the crack committee to help fund revenue sharing where it was envisioned in the five year plan there would be no money for revenue sharing.
01:25:38
And that was an innovative approach because the decal money which relates to automobiles would have a relationship to funding transportation projects.
01:25:49
So it was thought to be a good approach to do that.
01:25:52
Now that revenue, that decal money is subject to this board approving an ordinance to raise that decal which is scheduled for you to hear in July.
01:26:02
So that's assuming that you will in fact raise those decal rates.
01:26:06
That was an assumption of the budget that is before you today.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:26:13
All right.
01:26:15
Okay, so Tom and Laura and Lindsay.
SPEAKER_02
01:26:18
Madam Chair, I'll just start off.
01:26:20
Laurie's gonna cover the numbers.
01:26:21
I would just tell you that there's nothing easy here after looking at it more closely.
01:26:27
So we're gonna share three different approaches with you, and each of them has its own challenges.
01:26:35
So Laurie's gonna cover
01:26:41
I'll just let Lori talk about the alternative approaches.
SPEAKER_07
01:26:47
Okay, we did the math on if you reduce the tax rate by 0.5.
01:26:56
and you shared it based with the schools and local government operations based on the way we had the penny divvied up.
01:27:06
It would be 73%.
01:27:07
The 60-40 penny.
01:27:09
Oh, I can do the 60-40.
01:27:10
I was talking about it another way as well.
01:27:12
I mean, there's two ways we can look at it.
01:27:14
We can go to the 60-40 and I have those numbers for you.
01:27:16
but also I thought that when Mr. Tisdat was up here we were looking at it in a little different way and I can share both of those directions for you.
SPEAKER_02
01:27:24
That's in the same ratio as it was put in the budget at the 1.5 was 1.1 for local government and 0.4 for schools so if you use the same ratio on coming up with this amount
01:27:36
That's what she's using now.
SPEAKER_07
01:27:39
That would be my first one.
01:27:40
I'm going to share both with you, so you'll have both of these, and if you can all write these down.
01:27:44
So the ratio, as Tom just described it, based on the increase in the proposed budget, would be a 73% cut to local government, totaling 605.
01:27:56
A 27% reduction to the schools, it would be 220.
01:28:04
So that would be based on that same ratio.
01:28:08
that Mr. Tisdat referred to.
01:28:11
Now, the 60-40 formula is actually a formula we use for our whole budget, and it actually does include capital.
01:28:19
So we always call it 60-40, but there's the formula itself that's an approved formula that we've used has a little capital piece to it.
01:28:27
So it's not that much, but I wanted to just use our same formula so we don't start at like a third formula.
01:28:32
so based on our formula if you would say reduce that by the formula that we normally use to share revenues which includes capital includes sub capital so here's the half penny if you think of it in that way it would be a seventy nine thousand dollar reduction of capital a four hundred and forty eight thousand dollar reduction to the schools and a two ninety nine
01:28:57
299,000 reduction for local government.
01:28:59
So that would follow the formula that we follow when we do this for the routine that we use rather than dedicating.
SPEAKER_05
01:29:08
A third approach would- Would you say those again, Lori?
01:29:11
Would you mind, please?
01:29:12
I'm sorry, Tom.
01:29:12
I sure can.
SPEAKER_07
01:29:14
Based on the formula, it would be a $79,000 reduction to capital, a 448,000 reduction to schools, and a $299,000 reduction to local government.
SPEAKER_02
01:29:26
Thank you.
01:29:28
A third approach would be to reduce the half cent from the penny going to capital.
01:29:37
That would be an $800,000 hit to the capital program.
01:29:42
and would be ongoing, so it would be 800,000 a year times five years, which is a pretty significant impact to the capital program.
01:29:54
So those are three approaches.
01:29:56
If you use the same ratio, local government comes up with 605 and school's only about 220.
01:30:01
The thing that's important about that is that
01:30:09
The reason that 1.1 cent was dedicated to local government was because of all the mandates and obligations.
01:30:18
We have, as you've heard me say a hundred times, no new positions, no expansions of services or new programs.
01:30:24
We even had to cut $400,000 over the next two fiscal years in operating expenses, and we reduced another 700,000 in local government.
01:30:35
In spite of the tax increase, that was 1.1 dedicated to local government.
01:30:40
Schools are not dealing with that same challenge on their side, and I'm not suggesting that they have a big, wonderful budget.
01:30:50
It's a modest budget on their side, but there are new positions and programs and so forth, and again, I'm not trying to suggest that they're very dramatic, but I just think as you think about the ratio,
01:31:04
If we come up with $600,000, that's basically against money that was dedicated totally to mandates.
01:31:12
and we're already cutting expenditures and expecting to cut more expenditures.
01:31:16
So it's really not an equal look in terms of how that's going.
01:31:22
We all know that the schools are required to put a needs-based budget together and they're following that requirement and so forth.
01:31:29
On the local government side, we don't have that choice.
01:31:32
We've got to come up with a tax rate that balances it.
01:31:36
So I don't think it's an apples to apples comparison.
01:31:41
So those are the three different ways that you could approach it.
01:31:46
If we have to come up with 605,000 on the local government side, it's not gonna be to not do some program we were hoping to expand.
01:31:57
It's things we have to do in that budget.
01:32:01
The SRO becomes the only thing, frankly, that's in that budget that is just a kind of a want-to kind of thing.
01:32:09
So as I said at the beginning, there's not any easy choices here on this.
01:32:15
The 250,000 from the decal fee, under normal circumstances, it's a general fund revenue that would be shared.
01:32:24
If it's shared, then that 250 isn't something we could put against the 605, so the challenge is even greater on the local government side.
01:32:32
So that's a tough place we find ourselves.
01:32:36
Those are three options.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:32:40
I would like to say one statement before we start.
01:32:46
The solution to all this is to go ahead and accept the county executive's proposed budget.
01:32:52
I know that hasn't come out very good when we started, but that still is a solution that's on the table.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:00
I'd be happy to make that motion again.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:06
Are there any others?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:08
We haven't talked about anybody who would support some of these other ones.
01:33:12
What we sent people away to do was find out the information so we could talk about those alternatives.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:16
So let's hear from everyone, how they feel about those.
01:33:20
Ann, would you like to start?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:21
I could certainly support 2% and the option two immediately.
01:33:28
The option one, I would prefer that we split it half and half or something because I think it's
01:33:37
impossible for local government to eat that $600,000 somehow right now.
SPEAKER_03
01:33:44
That's my view.
01:33:44
I'm not following option one.
01:33:46
What do you mean?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:47
Well, I think that having 73% of all the reductions in local government is something we can't handle.
SPEAKER_03
01:33:54
I agree.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:33:54
And so I was, if people, I guess I would first propose, do we have four people who will support option two that Lori read?
01:34:02
Let's see about that first before we go any further.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:05
and we're sure that that's the impact on the schools.
01:34:07
We've worked that out.
SPEAKER_02
01:34:11
according to the formula that we use.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:13
That includes the CIP.
SPEAKER_02
01:34:16
That's roughly 80,000 reduction to the CIP as well.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:18
Which includes the, yeah.
01:34:21
I probably will not support that.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:23
So the 79,000 comes out of the CIP and that could come out of school projects or general government, whatever, right?
01:34:31
Is that correct?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:32
That's a fight we'll have to have in government.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:34
But it could be either one, okay.
SPEAKER_07
01:34:36
I'm sorry, could you repeat your question?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:39
Option two, the $79,000 that comes out of the CIP money, that's a divided...
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:34:45
Yes, yes.
01:34:47
That's the $448,000 for schools and $229,000 for county government.
01:34:51
I think we'll hear about that.
01:34:52
$299,000.
01:34:53
$299,000.
SPEAKER_11
01:34:55
I'm sorry, could you just give a basic description of why more is coming out of the schools?
01:35:02
Counterintuitive, I'm sorry.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:35:04
This was the long established 60-40 new revenue policy.
01:35:10
I'm sorry, thanks.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:35:11
But for years, the new and improved formula includes the CIP and for years it did not include the CIP.
01:35:19
That's not an argument we can have right now.
01:35:22
We had the schools were getting 0.4 out of the 1.5 cent and I just
SPEAKER_05
01:35:30
Madam Chairman, may I recommend that we actually vote on each one of these motions and just move through them very quickly and that will allow us.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:35:38
Do we have a second for what I moved?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:35:40
I would love just to hear from people if that's okay so we have some idea because if you don't know what's coming up on the next one you know for those who vote before others we might have round after round so if we could just
01:35:56
Are you willing to just give us your idea about what you're thinking at this point?
SPEAKER_05
01:36:02
Well, certainly option one is out.
01:36:05
I agree 73% is just an impossible amount for us to deal with since we've taken salaries off the table and I do think we need to look at the 79-404-299 scenario.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:36:21
Okay, and Brad can you tell us how you're feeling at this point?
01:36:36
You willing to support anything?
SPEAKER_03
01:36:45
I will say Larry to your comment about the sidewalks and what's been committed.
01:36:51
I would disagree that there are a handful of sidewalks that haven't started that it still makes no sense to me to spend money to make sure that we don't have to pay back a small amount.
01:37:01
I think there are some sidewalks that a small amount of expenditures have been made and that those could be cut back.
01:37:10
which could impact the money that we need to be dedicating to the CIP.
01:37:15
I say that mainly again because I don't like the idea of taking on debt while we can't pay the debt that we already have.
01:37:24
It doesn't mean I don't want to build these things.
01:37:26
It doesn't mean that I don't think they're worth it.
01:37:29
It just means that assessments didn't go up enough to help fund the aspirations that we have for those kind of capital investments.
01:37:37
I wish I had brought this up or really I think I wish I had been more articulate about these concerns.
01:37:46
I do think I have mentioned in the past about not supporting some of these sidewalk projects but that way we could have gotten a better number from Trevor about where we stand financially on how much
01:37:59
the net impact would be by removing several of these projects.
01:38:05
I'm willing to gamble that removing a handful of these sidewalk projects would be a net of $1.6 million, the one penny dedicated to the CIP.
01:38:18
I feel fairly confident, but again, I would have to turn to staff to try to make that assessment.
SPEAKER_02
01:38:26
If you're just trying to get
SPEAKER_03
01:38:29
a half a cent if you if you want to not transfer all of that penny over and that assessment could be done and yeah and it's it's not about the pennies it's about the principle of taking on that debt um so i don't want to i see where you're going with that and the result would be probably not taking on that debt
01:38:52
As far as that $79, $448, and $299, yeah that half penny I think is something that I would hope everybody could agree on because in my mind, Ann may not like this, but that $299 is really reflective of the $288 that we saved in the healthcare savings.
01:39:14
If I do my math, the 448 is offset by the 887 that was received by the schools from the healthcare savings, and then 79 is just absorbed by the CIP.
01:39:27
So that's kind of where I stand.
01:39:30
I'm still wrestling with this sidewalk thing.
01:39:34
I still feel that
01:39:36
I don't support that.
01:39:38
I can tell you and be very clear that supporting the budget's gonna be something I probably will not do because it does contain things like last year.
01:39:47
It contains capital projects that I don't support.
01:39:50
And I did not vote for the CIP, if I remember right, last year because of actually the sidewalk projects that I don't support.
01:39:57
And I think that will be a good thing.
01:40:01
The addition of the $1 million that were taken on in debt to do design for an addition to a school versus a new school is another concern that I have.
01:40:12
But right now our goal is obviously to set a tax rate.
01:40:15
The budget will be another discussion.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:40:18
Right, so you're okay with option two under this situation.
01:40:25
We are not deciding at this point where that money is coming from, am I correct?
SPEAKER_03
01:40:30
To me, there are
01:40:37
I guess you could say there's three different things on the table for me.
01:40:40
One is the transfer over to the dedicated CIP money, how we're actually viewing that healthcare savings, and then if we're even entertaining an addition or an exchange, this half-penny reduction.
01:40:56
So to me, there's a few things floating out there that
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:40:58
Right now we're trying to concentrate on a half penny.
01:41:02
I think we're looking at support for a half penny and then support for which one of these options.
01:41:09
And we could take the half penny first, but there was a lot of concern as to where that money was going to, how that money was going to affect the schools.
01:41:18
So right now we're just talking about those two things.
01:41:21
Option two is what I'm hearing and a half penny and you'd be willing to support that as a tax rate but the budget is a different thing.
SPEAKER_03
01:41:30
Correct?
01:41:31
I don't know.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:41:33
You don't know.
01:41:34
Okay that's fair.
SPEAKER_03
01:41:35
I go back to my initial comment about the sidewalks and the taking on debt and we can't afford debt.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:41:40
Norman, can you comment on the half penny and the option one or two?
01:41:48
Or three, we have a third one taking it totally out of the capital, the CIP.
SPEAKER_11
01:41:53
Well, to start with, I would definitely vote for half penny for any of those, if that's what it takes.
01:42:00
In the context of a $374 million budget, we're talking about, you know, $50,000 shifting one way or another seems
01:42:08
like we're almost there.
01:42:10
So what I heard Ann say, I'm not sure if it was her motion or just a comment, but was that if we did option two and kind of split the difference between the schools and the local government and the capital or you know just somehow
01:42:26
Splitting the difference there, I think that's kind of everybody wins and to some extent that's muddling through, but it's, you know.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:42:33
That's the 299 for general government, for local government, and 448 for the schools is what she's talking about.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:42:41
Yeah, that's the option two that Lori read.
01:42:43
It's not an even split.
01:42:45
Well, I did, because I couldn't accept option one, I said maybe there was another option that we didn't have worked out, but I'm very happy.
01:42:53
My official motion was in support of option two.
SPEAKER_11
01:42:55
Okay, I'm sorry.
01:42:56
I thought you had said somehow putting it all together and then doing a 50-50 split.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:01
But considering the health savings and the big differences in those amounts, you know, I think that option two is fair.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:09
All right.
01:43:09
And, Diantha?
SPEAKER_11
01:43:11
I think we're there.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:12
Oh, let's see.
01:43:13
I didn't let you finish.
01:43:15
No, no.
SPEAKER_11
01:43:16
That was my closing
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:18
Okay, so you could accept that option two with a half penny, if that's what, okay.
SPEAKER_11
01:43:26
Yeah.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:27
All right, yeah.
01:43:30
And Diantha, where are you?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:43:32
I'm still, Wayne, I could certainly support option one.
01:43:40
And option two, I'd have to, I'm very concerned about still, it seems like to me that,
01:43:47
the schools at the very beginning were only getting not completely what the 60-40 split would indicate.
01:43:59
And I'd be very concerned about this one.
01:44:02
But let's see how it goes with Rick and Pam.
01:44:07
I mean, Liz, I'm not sure that I'm gonna support option two.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:44:11
I just wanna be, well, I'll say what I can do.
01:44:14
If we are absolutely sure
01:44:17
that this 60-40 split is correct.
01:44:21
I mean that those are the figures because Dean was talking about the possibility.
01:44:25
You're not, you're not.
01:44:27
No, I'm not.
SPEAKER_02
01:44:27
Dean was talking about another method, but the 60-40 calculation and the 10% off the top for capital, which is the 79, that is absolutely correct on a half a penny.
01:44:37
But Dean's was another methodology altogether.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:44:40
It's another methodology, okay.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:44:43
That's why you look at the 60-40 split.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:44:46
Well, if- I don't think we- Rick, have you made some- Yeah, he said it sounds right.
01:44:54
He's okay with the option to half penny.
SPEAKER_05
01:44:56
Yeah, I'm in favor of option two.
01:44:58
I do want to add a point, Brad's point.
01:45:01
I think if we do agree on option two, we should ask Larry to investigate
01:45:07
all of the existing contracts that are due to be let for sidewalks and to see if any of those contracts can be altered in any way without damaging the standing borrowing status of the county or to jeopardize VDOT
01:45:24
funding, et cetera.
01:45:25
So per Brad's point, if we actually look at each one of the contracts individually, potentially there may be one or two that could be delayed.
01:45:36
So if we can do that, wonderful.
01:45:38
If we can't do that, then we understand.
SPEAKER_06
01:45:41
To that point, there are a number of projects where construction contracts have not been signed.
01:45:50
Those projects could be stopped
01:45:54
But those projects have expended money for design, engineering, and property acquisitions.
01:46:02
To the extent that that money has been expended, we have to reimburse VDOT for their share of those expenses.
SPEAKER_11
01:46:10
but are there some projects that haven't even gotten that far?
01:46:13
We will clearly do a full evaluation.
SPEAKER_06
01:46:15
We would have to identify those, but the majority of projects have expenses associated with them.
SPEAKER_02
01:46:21
We won't be able to resolve this tonight, but we will absolutely do a full evaluation based on this conversation, I can assure you.
SPEAKER_03
01:46:27
If we have to pay VDOT $30,000 to not spend a half a million, I think you all know where my vote lands on that one.
SPEAKER_02
01:46:35
That's why I think we have to do the evaluation and we're gonna
01:46:38
Do that right away.
01:46:39
Trevor just doesn't have enough time to pull those numbers together.
01:46:43
Right.
SPEAKER_03
01:46:44
And I dropped that bomb on everybody today and I apologize, but I have been mulling over this, taking on debt and not being able to pay our debt dynamic that I just, you know.
01:46:53
Unfortunately I am not, like I told Rick, I'm not as quick on my feet as he is.
01:46:59
Some of y'all are actually, y'all are much better.
01:47:02
It takes me time to absorb some of this.
SPEAKER_02
01:47:04
Frankly transportation revenue sharing money used to go to roads.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:47:10
Period.
SPEAKER_02
01:47:11
and we shifted a number of years ago to sidewalks and we just seem to have continued on that path and I think it's good to stop and take a question, make sure about this.
01:47:19
Some of these monies could actually be set aside for some critical road connection if we built the money up which is what we've done in the past.
01:47:26
So I think it's a good thing and we will do a full evaluation so we'll do that immediately so that we can look at it regardless of your adoption of the budget.
SPEAKER_03
01:47:34
Well, there is the option three that is if the healthcare savings is taken into account and that's split amongst the 60-40 split and then you take into account the objection I have to transferring or dedicating a penny to the CIP
01:47:54
you're talking about a tax rate that's 82.8 that still provides the 1.1 cents for dedicated to government and 0.4 cents dedicated to the schools.
01:48:05
To me that is another option that some of us should consider.
01:48:10
It goes back against what we decided on with the healthcare savings last night but it does
01:48:17
get us a little bit closer to an agreement.
01:48:21
The one penny for dedicated to CIP, again, that I would hope that staff can find $1.6 million in our capital budget that we could back away from.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:48:34
I think part of the capital program that benefited over many many decades about having constant investment was that you had some cash to be able to do something and not have to borrow every penny or to borrow money for maintenance is a really big expense when you're not even getting new facilities for it which was something that got us into a lot of
01:48:53
Hartburn during the recession.
01:48:56
So we are facing some pretty high court expenses and things like that.
01:49:01
So I hope that we will find a way to leave our very small transfers to CIP alone so that we can
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:49:09
I'm going to say one thing and I'm not quite sure how we're going to fashion this motion if we're going to try to go with options or we're just going to go with the tax rate.
01:49:21
Maybe the best thing to do is just to go to the tax rate right now.
01:49:24
but I am extremely disappointed to vote for two instead of two and a half.
01:49:29
I will vote for the two very, very reluctantly.
01:49:33
I do think that the whole healthcare savings should go back on the table.
01:49:39
I always hate putting ACE back on the table but I'm perfectly willing to do that.
01:49:44
If we're unable to come up with a better reason, I will vote for that but I think what we probably ought to do first is have
01:49:53
A motion for the two cents and if everybody has some agreement on that would be the first place to go.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:50:02
Are we in agreement for this vote that salaries remain as they were presented in the original budget of time?
01:50:13
That we're not going to salaries?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:50:15
We don't have four votes.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:50:17
I just want to make sure because I heard a lot of motion about discussion about taking you know adjusting salaries.
01:50:24
I just am not going to support anything that adjust salaries.
SPEAKER_03
01:50:27
We make a motion Trevor do you have some more information if it's okay Tom?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:50:32
Sure.
SPEAKER_03
01:50:34
I try not to complicate things, but I understand that it was my grenade that set this all off.
SPEAKER_00
01:50:38
I just wanted to clarify on as it relates to reduction of the dedication to CIP, if the half cent is pulled out, that's $800,000.
01:50:48
That's equity funding and that's annually.
01:50:53
So that would be then times five.
01:50:56
to pull the projects and reduce the CIP, it would be significant.
01:51:02
To take a penny out would even be more significant.
01:51:05
It can be done, but there'd be a lot of work to do.
SPEAKER_02
01:51:08
I think it can be said stronger that if you pull a penny out, we may have some difficulty meeting our debt service payments without some dramatic change.
SPEAKER_06
01:51:18
There would have to be dramatic reductions in the five-year CIP if you pulled a penny out because it's
01:51:23
multiplied by the debt service.
SPEAKER_02
01:51:25
That's $8 million, so.
01:51:28
And I think that you are going on to a different place, but if we get back to that, I think we gotta really look at that carefully.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:51:33
Okay.
01:51:34
All right, so Ann has a motion on the table.
01:51:37
Two.
01:51:37
Okay.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:51:37
Two.
01:51:37
Two percent at option two.
01:51:39
Two cents, not percent.
01:51:41
Yeah, sorry, two cents.
SPEAKER_06
01:51:42
Just to clarify that, is this a straw poll vote so that you get.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:51:48
I thought we'd already done that, and I was making an official motion.
SPEAKER_06
01:51:51
Then your motion would be.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:51:52
Oh, okay.
01:51:53
Where is it?
SPEAKER_06
01:51:54
To adopt the resolution to set the calendar year tax, 2016 tax rates, and then the number that would be changed would be the number that's under items 1, 2, and 3.
01:52:07
The .844 would be changed to be .839.
01:52:15
849, I'm sorry, 839.
01:52:21
So that would reduce the advertised tax rate by one half cent for real estate, manufactured homes, and public service properties, which are the ones that we count as real estate for purposes of building the budget.
SPEAKER_03
01:52:37
Before someone makes a motion, Tom, do you feel that staff could accommodate a half penny reduction in the CIP dedication?
SPEAKER_02
01:52:45
In the CIP?
SPEAKER_03
01:52:45
That instead of one penny, it being a half penny?
SPEAKER_02
01:52:48
Yes.
01:52:49
And it, not without some changes, but the first year- It'd be hard changes, yes, but- It went out of our balance sooner.
01:52:56
And at the end of the five years, we'd have less of a balance.
01:52:59
So it's things we can adjust in the strategic planning session.
SPEAKER_03
01:53:01
Some projects that we may not do.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:53:03
Right, there would have to be a lot of them because one year we're already down to $800,000 in the end of the year.
SPEAKER_02
01:53:09
We can make our debt payments and we'll have some, our balance will then drop more quickly but we have time to recover on a five-year plan to decide what the priorities are.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:53:18
We are just pushing everything off and kicking the rock.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:53:23
We've got to set a tax rate today.
01:53:25
I just want to get clarification from staff.
SPEAKER_02
01:53:27
I don't feel the same about a pennies reduction at all.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:53:31
I would rather we just get through the tax rate right now.
01:53:34
Then figure out.
01:53:35
I think we need to just get through the tax rate.
01:53:37
It's 5.30, it's our last day to do that.
01:53:40
So, Ann has a motion on the table.
01:53:43
I second it.
01:53:44
And you second it.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:53:46
With the wording that Larry gave us.
01:53:48
and repeat the wording, what was it again, so everybody knows.
SPEAKER_02
01:53:51
Just the resolution that's on the screen with the change in .844 to .839.
01:53:55
Okay.
01:53:55
Two cent tax increase instead of two and a half.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:54:03
Okay, Travis.
01:54:04
Ms. Palmer.
01:54:05
Yes.
01:54:05
Mr. Randolph.
01:54:06
Aye.
01:54:06
Mr. Sheffield.
SPEAKER_11
01:54:07
Yes.
01:54:08
Mr. Dill.
01:54:09
Yes.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:54:10
Ms. Mallek.
01:54:11
Yes.
01:54:11
Ms. McKeel.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:54:12
No.
01:54:14
Well, we passed that.
3. Discussion and Adoption of FY 2016/17 Capital and Operating Budgets.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:54:16
Now, we know this is going to cause some problems with appropriations if we don't go and pass the budget today, but I can't help but think that it's probably not a good idea right now.
01:54:30
You want to do the option.
01:54:32
I'm not sure I'm ready to do it.
01:54:33
We have four votes to do that.
01:54:37
I can
SPEAKER_03
01:54:37
I will make a motion that, well maybe not a motion, but it's very clear to me where this half cent can come down and that is in the healthcare savings.
01:54:48
We have the money there.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:54:54
But what we would be doing is you're talking about the option 60-40.
01:54:58
Yes, but not necessarily are you combining that with the health care savings?
SPEAKER_03
01:55:05
Not combining it, I'm applying the 60-40 split to the health care savings which would, no I'm sorry, I'm yes applying the health care savings to that dynamic.
SPEAKER_02
01:55:16
There's two issues here.
01:55:17
One is whether you want the reduction to be distributed according to the existing 60-40 split.
01:55:24
And then on the local government side, we could go to the 288 to take care of our portion of it, I think is what you're saying.
01:55:31
Obviously there's a bunch of other ways we could do that.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:55:34
So does the motion that you're making take the ACE off the table?
01:55:39
Is that correct?
01:55:40
Yes.
01:55:40
Okay, it takes ACE off the table.
01:55:42
Okay.
01:55:43
So we're using that to do the $299 would be taken with ACE and the $448 with the schools would have to figure out what they're going to do and we would find the $79,000 out of the CIP.
SPEAKER_05
01:55:56
Could I follow up on a point that Brad made earlier on his motion that if the term before us is a structural imbalance, and I think all of us have to be looking at ways that we share in the sacrifice in this imbalance, there are no sacred cows.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:18
There never have been.
01:56:20
There never has been.
01:56:21
Help me with the healthcare savings.
01:56:22
When we're talking about a 60-40 split on the healthcare savings,
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:26
The numbers just happen to work out right.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:31
I mean yeah but the reality is that for the healthcare savings the 60-40 split
01:56:38
It doesn't make sense.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:40
The healthcare savings is based on the number of employees who have the savings and that's why the school has $880,000.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:47
But to call it the 60-40 split is very confusing because they have so many more employees.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:56:53
That's not what, Brad was saying the option two of the amounts.
01:56:57
It just happens to work out.
01:56:59
The health care savings is the source of the money that it can be taken from.
SPEAKER_03
01:57:04
It just happens, the numbers happen to work out.
01:57:07
The calculations for the health care savings is 288 on the government side, 887.
01:57:12
That's correct.
01:57:13
So to me,
01:57:15
The tax rate we just applied, the schools compared to a week ago are still net 440 above where they were a week ago.
SPEAKER_02
01:57:24
That's money freed up from what they had planned to spend that was already built into their budget.
01:57:30
You're right.
SPEAKER_11
01:57:36
I don't understand why it all has to come out of ACE.
01:57:38
We talked about stormwater and
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:57:44
I'm happy to backfill with some of those other sources that Tom had mentioned before to put some money into ACE, absolutely.
01:57:53
ACE's program is deferred future, it's removal of future debt when you have conservation and we also have benefits
01:58:03
from not having to invest in other storm waterways because of the conservation acreage which we have.
01:58:09
So it's not money going thrown in a hole.
01:58:11
It is actually a tremendously beneficial.
SPEAKER_11
01:58:14
And it's matched.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:58:15
And it's matched by the state.
01:58:17
And then, but so is the 250.
01:58:20
You want to go ahead and vote on the option of
01:58:24
Madam Chairman, we have a motion that's still on the table on option two.
SPEAKER_05
01:58:40
We never voted on any of these motions.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:58:43
So what we voted on before was the two cents, but not the option two.
01:58:47
Okay, so we'll vote on the option two now.
01:58:49
That's fine.
SPEAKER_05
01:58:50
My recommendation, I like your idea, but I just think in terms of point of order, we have an existing motion on the table.
01:58:58
We suspended that to vote on the tax rate, but we have a motion still before us in terms of option two.
SPEAKER_06
01:59:06
I don't think it's been seconded, but it's
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:59:08
This is option 2 with the dollars that Laurie read out to us, $79,000 from the CIP, $448 from the school board, and $299 from local government.
01:59:29
Sources to be determined.
SPEAKER_02
01:59:33
This would be to implement the half cent reduction in the proposed budget according to the existing formula for split between CIP schools and local government.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
01:59:46
Okay, is there a second?
01:59:48
I just seconded.
01:59:49
Okay, I'm sorry.
01:59:50
Three times.
01:59:50
Getting tired, I'm sorry.
01:59:52
Okay, no.
SPEAKER_05
01:59:54
Mr. Randolph?
01:59:55
Aye.
01:59:56
Mr. Sheffield?
SPEAKER_11
01:59:59
Yes.
02:00:01
Mr. Beale?
02:00:01
No.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:00:03
Malek, yes, McKeel, no, okay.
SPEAKER_02
02:00:11
So we had two other options.
02:00:14
One was to take a half cent out of the CIP, which would not affect the first year, but during your strategic planning session, as you look to the future on your capital program, which is something you're going to need to do anyways, you would then have to consider how by the end of the fifth year, you either reduce projects or increased revenues to meet what is a very minimal CIP, but you still have more thoughtful time to do that.
02:00:42
and obviously the other option was 73% from local government and 27 from schools.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:00:49
Or you could do a third and just do 50-50 or something like that, but that would complicate life.
SPEAKER_02
02:00:54
If you wanna do 50-50, then it's 375 from schools and 375 from local government.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:01:02
Any comments from those of us who voted no on that one?
02:01:06
Diantha?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:01:07
I would support the, I think what we're talking about was option one.
02:01:15
That's what I would support.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:01:16
Would you support taking it out of the CIP for right now and looking at that for further investigation during our strategic plan?
SPEAKER_03
02:01:25
Perhaps.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:01:26
Perhaps.
SPEAKER_03
02:01:27
How about you?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:01:32
because we have the strategic plan.
SPEAKER_02
02:01:33
And we can figure out how much of that half cent can go towards sidewalks and therefore not have an impact if you all come back to sidewalks.
SPEAKER_11
02:01:44
If we can pull it out of sidewalks, that would be the easy way to do it, obviously.
SPEAKER_03
02:01:47
Yeah, but I'm wrestling with the fact that I voted for this tax rate because I was hoping that the schools and the general government would share in the impact given the healthcare savings.
02:01:57
So that's where I'm gonna stand.
02:01:59
Well, they will.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:02:00
They do.
SPEAKER_03
02:02:00
No, they won't.
02:02:02
Right now, based on what you're suggesting, the county's taking the 100% impact.
SPEAKER_02
02:02:08
That second motion failed, which is what Brad's saying, and now you're trying to figure out how alternatively you'll come up with the half cent.
SPEAKER_03
02:02:14
We take it out of sidewalks, which, again, I support, but I voted for the tax rate because I thought we were going to share in this burden, and that's clearly not going to happen.
SPEAKER_06
02:02:23
A half penny will be more than sidewalks.
SPEAKER_02
02:02:26
The CIP is a five-year plan and you all have the opportunity in a month to review that and see how much of the sidewalk reductions if there's enough support.
02:02:42
would help offset that half cent reduction.
02:02:45
We don't have answers for that tonight, and it may not be much.
02:02:49
I don't know what it's going to be, but we can't answer it tonight.
02:02:52
But you have, it's a five year plan.
02:02:55
The first year is not going to be in jeopardy, and you have an opportunity to set some priorities in that CIT.
02:03:02
sidewalks and everything else as a part of our discussions over the next several months.
02:03:06
So that is an alternative which I think is viable given the strategic planning work that we have ahead.
02:03:14
But don't think that a half a cent on a CIP that's just doing maintenance and a few mandated projects is not gonna have some impact.
02:03:21
But you have an opportunity to figure out how to address that.
SPEAKER_03
02:03:26
I still stand by the fact that I was expecting us to share.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:03:31
So why don't you... We'll vote for option two and then we'll be all set.
SPEAKER_03
02:03:36
No, I stand by the fact that we have a healthcare savings that has already been identified as a win for the schools and a wash for the local government and it doesn't... How is that different than option two?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:03:49
I don't understand.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:03:51
It is, he's saying that option two.
SPEAKER_03
02:03:53
Option two just failed.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:03:58
We had a 3-3 and Brad voted for option two.
02:04:03
It was Diantha and Norman and myself who did not vote for it.
02:04:09
and the reason why I didn't vote for it is because I'm concerned about how we're going to reach that.
02:04:19
We used that money, the schools are using that money for good purposes to close their gap.
02:04:25
We're using it for good purposes.
02:04:27
and I'm concerned about using that and that's why I voted against it.
02:04:35
I feel a little bit more, I hate taking out of the capital but I feel a little bit more comfortable right now doing that given where we are right now and the impacts that it's going to have on the operating budget and that's where
SPEAKER_03
02:04:50
I'll tell you, I had a completely different read of where we were going, so I feel a little jaded on the vote on the tax rate.
02:04:57
Yeah, I do too, actually.
SPEAKER_11
02:04:58
So are you suggesting that the school should not pay anything?
02:05:05
So what is, I think maybe the compromise is for you to decide what is okay for the schools to pay.
02:05:13
You don't want them to pay $448,000.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:05:15
No, the capital, if you take it out of the capital, if you take it out of the capital, it goes to both.
02:05:22
It goes to both.
SPEAKER_11
02:05:23
It can go to both.
SPEAKER_03
02:05:24
We know what we're gonna take it out of.
02:05:26
We don't have any guarantee that's gonna come out of the schools.
02:05:29
We have an operating option in front of us that makes sense.
02:05:35
We've seen a reduction in healthcare cost.
02:05:38
The math is there.
02:05:40
It's proportionate to the reduction in the cost.
02:05:45
I'm confused about why we're trying to make an issue more complex than it needs to be but again that's why I voted for the tax increase because I felt like okay that was our I'll tell you what I will point that's really in favor of that is that it's one-time money used for a one-time thing and we really need to
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:06:01
This way it'll be available for re-discussion next year.
02:06:05
So I hope somebody will join us on option two.
SPEAKER_03
02:06:09
If I put it this way, right now, if we were to go that way, then we have effectively reduced the future tax rate by another half penny because of the healthcare cost.
02:06:19
If we go the capital way, we have not.
02:06:21
We're going to have to vote on that half penny next year.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:06:25
That's another way to look at it.
02:06:26
I'll tell you what, I will change my vote and I will go with the 60-40 option two.
02:06:30
reluctantly, but I will do that.
02:06:32
So if somebody wants to make a motion again, I'll vote for it.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:06:35
And this whole discussion that we've had tonight is doing exactly what Brad just said is pushing everything.
02:06:41
And it's just going to be increasing what we're going to be dealing with in the next few years.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:06:47
to get this legal and get the tax rate taken care of.
02:06:53
I'm willing to go ahead and vote for it.
02:06:55
Larry, would you like to say something?
SPEAKER_06
02:06:56
The tax rate is taken care of.
02:06:58
Oh, I'm sorry, the tax rate.
02:06:59
You voted on the tax rate.
02:07:00
The tax rate has been set.
02:07:01
What is left to do is to approve the budget, and the budget resolution that Lori has prepared does not yet reflect
02:07:13
So she would need to plug in those option two numbers for you to adopt a budget, to officially adopt a budget.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:07:24
Okay, so if I am not ready to vote, there may be four people that are willing to vote, but if I am not ready to vote where exactly that money, if we're taking it out of, totally out of ACE or where we're taking it out of, would we just postpone this option too, because Lori would have to get that into the resolution.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:07:43
Option two can be voted, it doesn't have, we can then have another discussion about which account to take it out of, but it'll still be adopted today.
SPEAKER_02
02:07:50
You all, the direction of this board
02:07:53
can be clear with a motion on option two if you support that.
02:07:58
It is a administrative matter for us to come back with the numbers.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:08:02
Okay.
SPEAKER_03
02:08:04
So let me just be clear, Liz.
02:08:05
Okay.
02:08:06
You say four ready, I know, I think Rick's ready, I think Ann's ready, I'm ready.
02:08:10
Okay.
02:08:10
So it's either you, Diantha, I will vote.
02:08:12
Or Norman, he's ready to vote.
02:08:14
I will do it.
02:08:14
And change the.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:08:15
I will do it, okay.
02:08:17
I move option two.
SPEAKER_05
02:08:18
Second.
02:08:20
Again.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:08:20
Mr. Palmer.
02:08:21
Yes.
SPEAKER_05
02:08:23
Aye.
02:08:24
Yes.
SPEAKER_11
02:08:28
No.
SPEAKER_07
02:08:30
Yes.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:08:32
No.
SPEAKER_02
02:08:37
We will bring back for your action those final adjustments based on your motion.
02:08:45
That concludes the budget adoption.
02:08:49
Budget approval.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:08:51
All right, so we've done the budget, and you're gonna come back.
02:08:57
I'm getting tired, I apologize.
SPEAKER_02
02:08:59
Again, I was gonna come back to you, and it's gonna be in front of you.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:09:06
We have used up our time for the bond referendum for the capital improvements program.
02:09:16
We'll have to reschedule that at some point.
02:09:19
We still have a closed meeting on the schedule and there are two things which I'm going to go through from the board matters not listed on the agenda.
5. From the Board: Committee Reports and Matters Not Listed on the Agenda.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:09:31
Do any board members have anything they'd like to say?
SPEAKER_03
02:09:33
I have one and Larry may not like me.
SPEAKER_02
02:09:38
You know, I didn't do my transactional disclosure statement.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:09:42
We haven't adopted the budget yet, so it's okay.
SPEAKER_03
02:09:44
All right, that's right, we haven't voted on the budget, so okay.
02:09:47
You gotta remind me to do that.
02:09:51
So with the House Bill 2 applications, there are two projects that have come to my attention that might make sense for us to apply.
02:09:56
One is the finishing the Berkmar Extended from Berkmar to Airport Road.
02:10:03
That little segment of the road would actually make Berkmar Extended more effective.
02:10:07
and then I'll keep this very general but in talking with Chip there are options we should be exploring with transit and park and rides and I'm gonna just nudge Chip to get with the MPO representatives to discuss that but given that park and rides were very heavily favored
02:10:27
and that there are new services being proposed in the county.
02:10:30
There's some correlation there that we might actually be able to see some award of state money for those things.
02:10:36
So I'll just want to put those out there.
02:10:40
Staff comes back with us on House Bill 2 projects.
02:10:44
We should consider that Berkmar extended one and parking rides.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:10:47
Any multi-modal things were well received throughout the state.
SPEAKER_03
02:10:53
The park-and-ride aspect, you know, VDOT's buying up right-of-way right now for Berkmar extended.
02:10:59
They're probably going to have some remnants left over that would almost be like a no-brainer for VDOT to actually just fund the construction because they've already bought the right-of-way and it can almost fit within those dynamics.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:11:13
Any other things that people would like to say?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:11:17
I would just have a request.
02:11:19
I think it would really be a good idea for clarity for the community and the public and everybody if we could at some point get pretty quickly the numbers of what actually
SPEAKER_02
02:11:31
and schools are getting county government is getting as well as the percentages I think because I think probably everybody is think it would be a good idea to and we're just talking about that and yeah and frankly and break down with the with a few minutes we can do that that's yeah I think the writing needs to be able to get it pretty quickly
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:11:53
Well we can go ahead and have the closed session and they can bring us the numbers after that.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:11:57
That'd be great.
02:11:58
Could you do it after closed session?
6. From the County Executive: Report on Matters Not Listed on the Agenda.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:11:59
We'll at least give that a shot and see what we can do.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:12:01
Do you have anything you'd like to tell us, Tom?
SPEAKER_02
02:12:04
No ma'am.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:12:04
Okay.
02:12:05
So can we have our motion to go into closed session?
7. Closed Meeting.
SPEAKER_11
02:12:11
I move that the board go into a closed meeting pursuant to section 2.23711A of the Code of Virginia under subsection 7 to consult with and be briefed by legal counsel and staff regarding specific legal matters requiring legal advice relating to the negotiation of an agreement for the Ivy Landville transfer station and the construction of the facility.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:12:36
Second.
02:12:38
Palmer?
02:12:38
Yes.
02:12:39
Mr. Randolph?
02:12:39
Aye.
02:12:40
Mr. Sheffield?
02:12:41
Yes.
02:12:41
Mr. Gill?
02:12:42
Yes.
SPEAKER_11
02:12:42
Ms. Mallek?
02:12:43
Yes.
02:12:44
Mr. Gill?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:12:46
Yes.
8. Certify Closed Meeting.
SPEAKER_11
02:13:02
I move that the board certify by a recorded vote that to the best of each board member's knowledge only public business matters lawfully exempted from the open meeting requirements of the Virginia Freedom of Information Act and identified in the motion authorizing the closed meeting were heard, discussed, or considered in the closed meeting.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:13:21
We need a motion to adjourn to April 19, 2000.
SPEAKER_02
02:13:36
We have a resolution with the adjustments I'd like to get you to act on it just to make sure that we've got this behind us
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:13:43
I'm jumping the gun.
02:13:44
I apologize.
SPEAKER_02
02:13:45
That's okay.
02:13:46
And she's on her way.
02:13:47
If you wanted to talk about another matter, which I think you were going to bring up, at least I'm not even mistaken.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:13:53
What was that other matter?
SPEAKER_02
02:13:54
The 19th and talking about this referendum.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:13:56
Oh, we've already decided we can't do that.
SPEAKER_11
02:13:58
I'm not.
02:13:59
Can we try to figure out another date right now while we're all here?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:14:02
Ella, do you have another option for us now?
02:14:06
What Ella will do, or Travis will send us out a couple options, and we'll figure it out, okay?
02:14:12
They'll have to.
SPEAKER_11
02:14:13
How about just later that day, Brad, you're not?
02:14:15
I'm unavailable.
02:14:16
No, he's gone.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:14:18
He is not gonna, we're gonna have the meeting with the planning commission without Brad, so we're still gonna meet that day, but.
02:14:29
We can't have the bond referendum discussion.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:14:32
I think we need everybody for that.
SPEAKER_07
02:14:35
We'll send you some dates, some suggested dates.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:14:40
Okay.
02:14:42
Well, what would you like to talk about?
02:14:44
The budget?
02:14:46
How are we going to know?
SPEAKER_11
02:14:49
Let's talk about next year's budget.
SPEAKER_02
02:14:54
I'll describe to you real quickly what
02:14:56
what Lori's gonna be bringing it just based on those three changes under option two.
02:15:05
there really are just gonna be several lines in the resolution that just had to be amended.
02:15:09
So the 79,000 for capital would just have to be reduced by 79, transfer to the school reduced, and then the other issue which was not 100% clear which is worth talking about at this point is the local government share at about 298,000.
02:15:30
We sort of didn't really get to the end conclusion on that, but we've adjusted the line based on the idea that rather than the health care savings at 288 being transferred to capital to pay for ACE,
02:15:51
It will stay back in the general fund so that the tax rate can come down.
02:15:55
That would be our share.
02:15:57
288 is 10,000 less than 298, so she's going to take the other 10 from the reserve for contingencies, which has plenty of money in it.
02:16:05
and that would resolve the matter.
02:16:09
I know Ms. Mallek is not greatly comfortable with that and she may want to make a comment on it, but that's something we did for you all to consider.
SPEAKER_03
02:16:18
And before she speaks, Ann, I'm open to you working with staff to find where that could be reduced before we adopt a budget.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:16:26
I have a suggestion based upon what was done last year in this very same interval, which was to say that if there is $250,000 or whatever it was at the end of the year after the audit, that it would be transferred at that point.
02:16:44
which was successful last year and so I would be happy to make that motion if that's something others would consider.
SPEAKER_11
02:16:53
Where does that come from?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:16:55
I'd be happy for more if people would be willing to do more.
02:17:01
was transferred to the ACE program after the audit out of the end of the year money.
SPEAKER_02
02:17:08
That exceeds what we had in the budget.
02:17:10
So if it exceeds what we had planned, then it would be available to go to ACE.
SPEAKER_11
02:17:15
Is that the same reserve fund that you're taking it out of now?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:17:19
It's called the fund balance that's transferred automatically to CIP.
SPEAKER_02
02:17:22
That would be excess balance of revenues over expenditures, which we anticipate having each year because we're not that tight.
02:17:30
So there's an opportunity to do that.
02:17:31
Typically that carries over into the capital budget to help offset.
SPEAKER_11
02:17:36
Yeah, we go to capital anyways.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:17:37
And this space is a capital account, so it's where it belongs.
SPEAKER_11
02:17:42
Okay, that sounds good.
02:17:43
Well if everybody's comfortable with that.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:17:46
I will move that and if someone wants to second it, we can, okay.
SPEAKER_11
02:17:51
Five times.
SPEAKER_05
02:17:52
Ms. Palmer?
02:17:53
Yes.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:17:54
Mr. Randolph?
02:17:55
Aye.
02:17:55
Mr. Sheffield?
02:17:56
Yes.
02:17:57
Mr. Dill?
02:17:57
Yes.
02:17:58
Ms. Mallek?
02:17:59
Yes.
02:17:59
Ms. McKeel?
02:18:00
Yes.
SPEAKER_02
02:18:01
Now you have this resolution in front of you that you would need to adopt.
02:18:05
It does reflect those changes in law review.
SPEAKER_07
02:18:08
I could read these for you.
02:18:11
The total budget was reduced by $826,031.
02:18:13
There's two parts to capital.
02:18:19
I'll start with capital was reduced by the $79,286, which was based on this formula.
02:18:24
that we work with.
02:18:27
School fund was reduced by 448-047.
02:18:30
Local government was reduced by 298-698.
02:18:32
In addition, the capital was also reduced by 288-288.
02:18:38
That was the ACE program as you just discussed.
02:18:45
We also were required to reduce the reserve for contingencies by 10,410.
02:18:48
Your new total budget is 375.
02:18:54
375,455,833.
SPEAKER_02
02:18:56
So you all could just move for adoption of this resolution as presented.
SPEAKER_11
02:19:12
So moved.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:15
We have to fix the names on this.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:20
Fix the names?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:23
if it matters, if this is gonna be filed, we need to fix the names.
SPEAKER_05
02:19:26
Who's Ms. Perkins?
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:28
Ms. Perkins is Ms. Perkins.
SPEAKER_05
02:19:30
Wow, I can't imagine how that goes.
02:19:31
Who are we excluding?
SPEAKER_07
02:19:32
Sorry, this is a, we were using some old formats, I'm sorry, back in our office.
02:19:36
It's okay.
02:19:36
Perkins, wow.
SPEAKER_03
02:19:38
Ms. Perkins.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:38
I don't think there was a Mr. Perkins, but there was never.
02:19:42
That will record the people that are present tonight.
02:19:44
There was definitely for 16 years.
02:19:45
There was a Mr. Perkins.
Ann Mallek
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:19:46
For 16 years.
02:19:47
Yes, those are here.
02:19:50
All right.
SPEAKER_11
02:19:52
He works in the budget office, Ms. Perkins.
02:19:55
I met her the other day.
02:19:55
Ella, what's her relation to you, Ms. Perkins?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:02
No Washington, no Jordans.
02:20:04
But there was a Mr. Perkins on the Board of Supervisors years and years ago.
SPEAKER_07
02:20:11
We were using a lot of, she was having to move things over from Excel sheets over to formatting and was, our apologies.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:19
Regardless, let's have a motion.
SPEAKER_11
02:20:23
Oh, you moved already, you moved.
SPEAKER_07
02:20:26
We have a second.
02:20:27
Second.
02:20:29
Mr. Palmer?
02:20:29
Yes.
02:20:30
Mr. Randolph?
SPEAKER_11
02:20:31
Aye.
02:20:31
Mr. Sheffield?
02:20:32
Yes.
02:20:33
Mr. Dill?
02:20:33
Yes.
SPEAKER_07
02:20:34
Ms. Mallek?
02:20:34
Yes.
02:20:35
Ms. McKeel?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:36
Yes.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:40
Okay, do we have any other business before we get a motion to adjourn?
02:20:45
No?
Adoption of Budget Resolution.
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:46
So what we need is a motion to adjourn to April 19th at 6 o'clock in room 241.
02:20:53
So moved.
SPEAKER_06
02:20:56
Is it at 6 o'clock?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:20:57
6 o'clock, we're not doing the 4 o'clock.
02:21:01
A second.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:21:02
Palmer?
Liz Palmer
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:21:03
Yes.
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:21:04
Mr. Randolph?
SPEAKER_11
02:21:04
Aye.
02:21:05
Sheffield?
02:21:06
Yes.
02:21:07
McKeel?
Diantha McKeel
Supervisor, Board of Supervisors
02:21:07
Yes.
02:21:08
Mallek?
02:21:08
Yes.
02:21:09
Mr. McKeel?
02:21:09
Yes.
02:21:11
Well,